Strategic Planning Committee - Wednesday, 16th December 2020 at 7:30pm - Lewisham Council Webcasting

Strategic Planning Committee
Wednesday, 16th December 2020 at 7:30pm 

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1 Declarations of Interests
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2 Minutes
3 Blackheath Business Estate, Blackheath Hill, London, SE10 8BA
3 Blackheath Business Estate, Blackheath Hill, London, SE10 8BA

I
thank you good evening everybody good evening everybody to his watching us on line welcomes this meeting of Lewisham council strategic planning committee I'm Councillor John passion and the Chair of the Committee and the other people that I hope you can see on screen all Members the Committee and some of the officers who are assisting us
and I think the marquee wanted to people we've not quite got this meeting technically set up correctly to the might be one or two people who are not yet supposed to be in the meeting appearing on your screen I would just outlines some rules for how we're going to proceed if you are not if you're a member of the Committee so one of the Councillors and I'll introduce you in just a moment then please leave your camera on at all times if you possibly can Fazeley your microphone muted unless you are invited to speak the speaking fees trying to members but it on so young had to do the year muted and log fig me
right if you are
not a member of the Committee are not actively preventing to us please as far as possible league your camera off and your mind muted at all times until you are invited to speak and then it will might be what appears on screen and on the web cast a bit easier to understand for most people so Mr. Spencer I think could you could you lead your Kavanagh off by I don't mind if you're inside the meeting of could you leave your camera and Mestia addressing the meeting from now
Councillor Walsh you've got your hand up to his that to indicate you and say OK for the down thank you we will use the to invite members of the Committee if you wish to indicate that you want to speak then could you please use the chap you only had to type Hugh or anything else to indicate the of putting your hand up that will enable me to see who has indicated and in what order and then to call you in that old I'll try Muldoon the chatter swell members and members of the public and any other participants in the meeting and please do not use the chap of or any other communications
between ourselves because it's possible for it to be broadcast and you're instructed if anybody tries to make any persuasive arguments to you then please in came the chap and please ignore those as a channel of communication there only for administration of the meeting
site No chatting amongst ourselves either members you will be Members and key officers you will be aware we have another channel of communication that we can use for necessary and if you get disconnected members if you draw disconnected from the meeting at any time Hollister you have to be able to follow all of the arguments that ensure that maker and informed decision so flip these do your best to communicate with me or with the offices are ideally using the what's at Channel we have set up
reached until all that we can cause the meeting if necessary do our best to get you connect the role she made reasonable efforts to do that if we can but otherwise subject to a quorum for the we may have to proceed without anybody who is technically lost said that but that is right
before we go on when the first thing we need to do his establish shoes present and in a voting capacity so as I said I'm the Chair of the Committee just mean who is the clerk to the committee if you could do a roll-call please of the Members who should be present and will establish him scarce and are properly connected she had there would be been the lyrical playing area where swearing clarity connected depend then you'd Laplace as so received a century's yourself as Chair and Councillor Giddens
he present just I'm present 0 sorry at sorry I have had I nearly forgot could you also when you introduce yourself just so we can get this out said the way could you prefer if you have any interest that the public should be aware of in your application we had to consider tonight and I I can declare that I had no no such interest that precludes me from participating Councillor Gibbons could you do that to please

1 Declarations of Interests

I certainly can I'd have no interest to declare
finally item thank you Councillor Olivier
thank you Claire I'm present and while I have no personal prejudicial interest Claire I think it's I should declare the iron ore Ward Councillor for the area has been represented and that I have been I've I've met with objectors and also the applicant on various occasions in the past year on this on this matter but throughout I've always kept an open mind thank you I we've had apologies from Councillor born
Councillor Clarke
and presence and I have no air interests thank you
Councillor Karon was going to be late and go without fear there his heavily on her and the nothing to declare lovely thank you we've received or sponsored by Sainsbury's Councillor Gareth well I just got I'm here that just by the skin of my teeth
I'm going to switch off the video whilst I quickly change the fact that eight that were were weirdly few you that we have received about poachers from Councillor Gallaher and now a Councillor Oaken bad they went
thank you present no impressed place like Councillor shake hasn't thank you and no interest to declare thank you and Councillor Walsh
thank you I am present no interest to declare bucks I will say I have been lobbied by the Blackheath Society and other the applicant say and also local residents
I take that and I think it's possible we have or will have Councillor Amanda derived and possibly Councillor Judy Campbell Beryl so Blackie ward councillors joining us under Standing orders and they may wish to speak under Standing orders when we get to that part of consideration of the application but I'll also that applicant day OK I will just run through your officers that I think we got present I believe we have Michael Forrester whose they major and strategic projects manager in the Planning Department Michael to say hello I hit OK we have Patricia plot
who is the senior Planning Officer who is going to be presenting the applications to extend say I put the shirt
and recruiting and then again on a hump advising us her on the technicalities of making this decision we have Charles Merritt
who is acting as our legal adviser the night say hello Charles I that RIM's hello Charles right OK and I think we have a clear Weezer and Claudette not from the 0 sorry to her Jazmine not Claudette Zaffar from the Committee support staff and in Vicar he's appeared earlier from IT support and James were filled Harries on drums and webcam right

2 Minutes

her came declarations we need to agreed the minutes of the last Strategic Planning Committee may think of the 17th of November as a true record if we had chance to see those sidenote no dissent as a Kerzner underspend 0 OK Councillor Karam yes sir carry on I'm sure that the industry minutes the recommendations we made were recorded but I hash to her I just need to let me be made make sure for legal reasons because it does seem to change wants we on actually meant so erred from page of Swann's first 1 3 9 or should be 15 for the whole thing he looks not take it for him universal looking at where they really
the presentation isn't right up against the last page of the minutes
and it's the third recommendation her and said we secure public access blah blah blah
7 days a week in perpetuity subject to securing suitable security measures such as CCTV now to me that means that if they can't get CCTV then that protection doesn't have now falls and I just wanted to be very clear about that
because I get that and I think you're making a valid point that that that that Minister really reflect the our intentions and again members who were present economy propped up my end who was present most of us were members who were present for that decision if you agree should we should we just hold offered agreeing these and Checkley check the wording getting cast any officers to come up with a better wording of that that reflects what our intention was in making a decision and obviously they go up the recording to refer to if necessary
assessment of collection should just to be clear we were saying his
perhaps I can get CCTV in blah blah blah but we weren't within make a conditional and I just think that wording is is under law can be interpreted that way the I tight I get that entirely I think I think the best thing are rather than trying draft words here and delay the rest of tonight business I think we can safely hold off agreeing these until the next meeting which will be in January concerned the date and POSC officers to review that and if necessary review the recording of our discussion
because I I agree with you I don't think it I think it's too ambiguous
a member or members happy to do that or any early members he sensing from from that course of action now I don't see any be doing that right so we're not agreeing these minutes at the moment and a bin refer them back to officers to review that if necessary we can look at drafts of the online and bouncing around the committee and bring the matter to the next Committee for agreement for cake
he is at his answer Jasmine
yes Chair you had asked that the Planning Office says should put your intentions in writes in an I think that's what they did was they will take it on board and were presented in the next meeting
well I'm and it before the next meeting we could see a draft of what those minutes or be purposefully as possible
and when we can we can make sure were happy that they are a true record of our intentions and what we actually said at the time of how we can do that because the volume of before we get to the meeting OK OK yeah area planning officers right OK let's move on then

3 Blackheath Business Estate, Blackheath Hill, London, SE10 8BA

so I think that's all of the preliminaries and now let's boots to the main item of business can I please could you make sure her clear it's your doing that or just mean the everybody who's involved in this item as being emitted from the lobby otherwise they will have trouble working like the failure webcast
and let me know when you think you've got them all in
so I just ask them if they can keep their cameras off himself
are becoming an alarming on
good evening surpassed news identified as Hillary
good evening but even with these Neti thank you very much for coming and helping to inform this process good evening Melanie past be hyper recognised a year on the list of people who are going to speak I think that's correct yes OK if I could ask you I highs I said this earlier in the meeting could any Mr. Shields' again now I Bercow again that Abballa enter and if I could just ask you I went through this in the preliminaries but we had some technical problems in moving people in and out of the lobby and so if you could keep your Mike's muted at all times except when fine by Eta speak please and if you could keep your cameras soffits set queueing times you're actively participating in the meeting it helps for people her either in the teams' meeting or watching on the web chart using a complex set of technologies to focus on the people are supposed to be sitting round our virtual table and paying attention which is the members of the Committee and any officers or witnesses her presenting to us so Hillary open and I'm not sure
what the rest of your name is but could you turn your could you meet your Mike please and also turn your camera off except when I invite you to participate actively in the meeting please
it you know how to do that I'll have somebody very current felt you do that
OK that's the might be OK if you could turn the camera off as well please you he should still be able to see the rest of the meeting going on on your screen
the adjustment can you can you help me identify the person who's in the meeting as Hillary he Lewis has on the Blackheath resident Chen
had seen tests meeting and she was present yet she's gone out yet OK right so I think I think we've got all the right people
appearing to be in the meeting and Michael you can you can turn the camera off if you like in the should talking to us but patsy Europe next I think and now we move on to trying to make a decision on this funny application
4
blackheath business Centre
I'm so had the way began to see these are going to ask the that the planning case officer to make a presentation to as illustrated with Southern some slides
and then Members might want so ask questions of flats and might be the longest part of our discussion and consideration then I'm going to ask the applicants to present their case for the application to us in editions all the other stuffing submitted her and I'm going to give them in this case after 10 minutes so sensuous and members of the Committee might want to ask them questions about what I have said and that ugliness get a come mostly by Mr. Ben Spencer then I'm going to get the same opportunity to all of the objects as I believe there are three people speaking on behalf of the objectors to this application and I Mr. P Handley Melanie SB and Howard shields and they will also have a total of 10 minutes which they are going to divide between them and me gets them ask them how they want to be told when they had five minutes or impelling on to tell how much time they got left
then there may be more discussion and am because Members might want to ask the or Jencks's questions about their presentation to then we may be to have more discussion we may need to ask the officers advising a similar questions and hopefully we will reach a decision and I'll make clear what that session has been and before we close the meeting I am my hon sorry we started Vallejo was aiming to try and conclude the distance by half past nine over so trying Bafta so he must finish correspondingly like right with that said her I will have the floor to Tricia plot and if you can the Che or scream and took us through your presentation Patricia
pinky chant before I will share my my presentation I with members and anyone and his am hated to to listen to the application I would like to note that as part of the subsequent representations that we have received place the publication of the main committee report we'd officers have prepared addendum report were does now available officers know that no new matters have been raised at that have not already been considered however we we have emphasised some of the issues are that members of the public have a race advice in the denim that was presented so I just wanted to make Members aware of this
I know now and I will move towards sharing my presentation
the Surrey I don't think that licked
I think I'm so my position
well
considering that you intended to say so go ahead
thank you for letting me know jam so my name as Patricia block and the senior Planning Officer and the case officer for this application this application is brought to the Strategic Planning Committee as more than 5 F valid objections have been received and the recognise resin situation has subjected application was submitted seeking planning permission for construction of two buildings at the site the first building will be 4 storeys and provide 2 thousand 200 and 88 square metres of commercial flexible floorspace
the second building would be part 7 and part 9 storey and would comprise 63 residential self contained flats 20 of these flats will be affordable units the remaining 43 would be open market flats the development would be car free with exception of free blue badge spaces to cut the thing in a Boards of transport 100 and 30 one cycle parking spaces will be provided across development proposal development was well provides a new planting and a public space improvement as was other associated X
the application site is located on the south side of black Keith Hill at the Raddatz and are subject to to this proposal is outlined in red on the location plan
the surrounding area comprising comprises mainly residential developments which front Blackheath Hill
the application site is an L-shape parcels lands comprising single storey commercial buildings occupied by small fees cost businesses with on site parking along the western and southern boundary of the of the site the building of so provide approximately 1 thousand and 80 square metres of commercial floorspace and the entire site is designated as a local employment location
the application site shows an access junction with Blackheath brain injury rehabilitation service building the vehicle access into the application site can be achieved from both sides of the carriage way
this is the view of the purchase of Site looking South
this is a view from within the site looking towards the north and west the entrance of the site is
this next view is from within the site looking east towards the think
the surround the emerged I'm thy scarred him for a view is a showing the proposed so lay out with two buildings as I described previously the commercial building is proposed to be located along the western boundary of the site and the residential building will be located in an over of the sides
the surrounding area has a variation in building footprint plot scale and heights typically the surrounding area to the east and north of the site comprises small private individual plants that to Offery storeys in height to the south and west of the site we can see examples of buildings of larger footprints and multiple stories said between communal gardens
this images showing the form and height of the proposed development taken from aerial view in the North East this next image showing an aerial view of the site from the south west
the application site forms part of the former truck quarry as a result Blacqueville rises from west to east with the site being set approximately 20 metres lower than Dove MA routes to the west and 5 metres higher than the cardinal house and talk House to the west this image those the difference in land and land levels and how the application sites co-sponsored them
the next next view is of proposed of an impromptu from the proposed development from the opposite side of the Blackheath Hill
members will note that only the commercial building will be visible he will know that this is the dark building to the rights to essential building due to its location at the end of the site would not be visit visible from Blackhill
this next image is a seizure image of proposed residential building
this is a further building which is showing the residential entrance the proposed building will be divided into two blocks block A located to the right would house 20 affordable HAP flats look be located to the left would house 43 Open House flats
the development has been planned and designed with equality in order to provide a tenure neutral developments
the architecture façade treatment demonstrates high quality materials and detailing to both flogs with the consistent language and style
the primary materials for the residual built on will be brick and pigments cast concrete these materials are high quality and durable and are considered to be acceptable there will be supported and paired with the metalwork by illustrates and aluminium windows
the development has admission before has been designed to meet the needs of the diverse population including disabled people older people and families with young children didn't turn now lay out and design of possession building has been designed to ensure that the residential experience is the same or of the same quality design and materials between both blocks at this image showing the proposed ground floor flats in block A and B
this next image is a is showing a typical layout for will to accessible units the watch adaptable yet allocated across both private and affordable block and they rent in size from 1 to free bed units providing good choice of commendation for wheelchair users the remaining flats meet m to standards the female provides the required 10 percent of wheelchair accessible units
at the ground floor the development will provide 94 square metres of communal playspace was successful to former since this space is aimed at younger age group Amini Our children under five and will be designed and designed with quality crafted a parroted areas for swinging sliding and climbing offering children a secure space to play
at the roof level block A the Affordable block located to the left of this image would have a rift of playspace of 100 and 95 square metres block B the open market flock
located in this image to the rights or would have a rooftop place of 200 and 62 square metres both routes will have various trial spaces walkways planted and spent planters and seating areas that suit a variety of play activities these spaces are multifunctional play areas and are designed and formally to be appropriated by the residence and they're not segregated by a specific age ranges
I am the secure by Design Officer have provided comments about access to both roofed of areas giving up the advice that is recommended that access to each rooftop is are only given to people living in in a block that there are they live in this is to ensure safety and to discourage anti-social behaviour which could happen as a result of mixing and that the residents
the proposed commercial building would it be as mission before will be located to the west of the application site this as a CGI image of how a look like
I mean material for the commercial building would be standing seam pigmented zinc and and texture powdered coated steel as well as at some a coloured pre-cast concrete
there is a section of the ground floor commercial space has been reduced in height to provide a deeper growing Zone to support the proposed climbers this is reflected in the two images die in front of you did on the left so as showing the planning submission
and the image on the right is showing the revised scheme and how that has changed
the applicant has also reduced the pirate parapet height in words were to allow greater visibility of the green roof and growing woe from flat contained in Cardinal house and talked of house to the west
rear elevation
it has also been amended to include claimants to mitigate against the loss of the belt of trees that and we'll be result of this application
the areas between the claimants will be fitted with opaque Revd agus to maintain privacy officers also not die internal corridors will be located on a building to create separation between the development and flats located in Cardinal house and Tokyo house
the commercial building would be arranged over four floors
we've proposed units range of between 15 square metres and 216 square metres
there's designs allows for a range of small to medium flexible spaces thought variety of businesses at various stage of of their existence
the roof of the commercial building would have a green roof and solar panels to ensure the sustainability of the proposal
the development will be car-free as mentioned before with the exception of free disabled parking spaces the applicant has confirmed that they will enter into permit free arrangements to restrict the ability of future residents and tenants of the commercial building from obtaining permits to park in a local controlled Parking Zone cycle parking will also be provided in line with intended to publish London Plan the provided sock cycle parking will be shouted secure and accessible
too old
development will be service off-street along the internal access routes whereby a dedicated loading bay will serve as commercial block the commercial blocks whilst the turning head facility near the disabled or parking offer service occasion for residential block
during the determination of the application the applicant has made positive changes to ensure that development is not not dominated by cars and the and better prioritise mode of sustainable and active travel other than that of a vehicle to encourage thing of modes of transport the applicant would provide a raised pedestrian facility across the site access with of Blacqueville details of this will be funded developed in consultation with TEFL which support of this I'm this measure the proposal also provides two separate routes for pedestrians with it within the application sites council highway officer and Transport for London confirmed that the widths presented for the pedestrian footways are acceptable
the existing site is predominantly made up of non permeable concrete areas the only area vegetate vegetation is the existing belt of trees on the western boundary 38 of the street it would be removed all the trees that will be removed our categorised as category C would I low quality trees the proposed development would provide over 50 new semi mature and established trees across the site giving a positive net gain of 12 new trees in addition to the proposed tree planting the applicant is also proposing to improve public realm through soft landscaping at the ground and roof level
I was not as outlined in the committee report to principle of development is supported the proposed development would provide a mixed use development would physician employment uses the application will re-provide the site industrial floorspace capacity with an uplift of 100 and 11 percent in a net increase together with provision of 63 new residential units the GLA and a stage 1 response was supportive of the scheme and the principle of developing decide with industrial intensification and residential use is supported in this location
the proposed commercial units have been designed to be flexible and adaptable for future ensuring their protection the residential component of the scheme would provide a property mix and tenure split with a high quality standard over special commendations provided for all potential future occupiers this public benefit is afforded substantial weight by officers the applicant has provided an appropriate affordable housing including good provision of family sized units this will be secured by a legal agreement and an early see to review viability or bisexual 1 Essex
the overall design approach would result in the form of development which would not detract or appear at odds there were a wider character and appearance of the immediate locality and the character of the area the proposal would not result in harm to local highway network or pedestrians or highway safety such of to imposition of conditions and financial contributions to secure things like raced on platform whilst the proposed development would have some impact on the adjacent neighbours officers considered that in light of mitigation measures proposed I am by the applicant the impact of it would not be acceptable and to refuse the application this this position
it's taken a kitchen site is located in urban and develop context and public benefits that the scheme offers for increase of employment space and new housing including affordable housing is significant the proposed development would on balance contribute to sustainable development subject to the imposition of conditions and the securing of 11 for relevant planning obligations including financial contributions the development is judged acceptable and in accordance with the Development Plan officers therefore recommend that the proposal Mrs. prefer and Faty
thank you Chair
Surrey refer
Assembly
thank you from the you need your Mike muted because your hunger LB through that brought
I can assure members of the Committee have questions they want to ask about that I I've got a few as well that and again Members' interests of a a an efficient meeting if somebody else manages to get him with your question first then and you usually answer before you ask it and so much the better and I'll try and do the same and I'll go last so I've got Councillor Walsh bursting Council upon of ear sewn James give floor thanks very much Chair and I have 2 questions my first is whether children over the age of five complain and I ask this every single meeting in every single week until his off-site service provision and I think that you know I'm starting to feel like we are off citing everyone over the age five and I know there's more accurate ground there
the the other thing I'm very concerned about is and an onus committee have been exercised by this before and I thought we were had come to sort of a consensus amongst us that all amenity area would be tenure blind and then when it was in a spread across rooftops in the surf in this kind of style and that all residents within that able enough about equally access all bits of rooftop and and I am quite like to see us look at changing the conditions around that to make sure that all means he reads top space accessible to all residents unless there is a report that says they won't achieve the appropriate secure by Design standards because I'm not convinced that this enables good next balanced communities to become forward when we have one group of residents who are social housing tenants not being out play with and our private rented tenants are private owner tenants and I'd like to see those changes at Endemol committee Phil
OK Kevin could I can I take your your question as well
you cannot go three so I pass a your your I took my next of that earlier than tackle on several of the time OK
give categoric heavy right thank you thank you Chair so sensual presentation Fisher just that McMurtry questions are on traffic ecology and also
the overshadowing so on on traffic people will be familiar of with that area will know that it's it's got the A to the Blackheath Hill you showed us Patricia that very narrow entrance coming in now it's you know you've got those two houses there and obviously and that that means is very narrow entrance now I'm interested to know more about Transport for London's view on this because they they haven't raise any objections on that and I'd quite like notice anymore going more detail on that
and and secondly whilst I appreciate that that we're trying to encourage active travel out I think great have all the cycles space that's brilliant but yes people living their businesses are going to have deliveries and I just want to I don't want things to be blocking up the entrance and causing trouble on that major road and plus we've also got the the brain injury unit next on a lot of traffic going in there so I need to be and some assurances on the traffic issue
then on the ecology no I get it that it's you know around the area we've got this at site of scientific interest around there are more than Hill there is that sort of canopy of trees one line of trees between the site and Parkside now I get it pretty much any development there is going to affect those trees and I appreciate this going to be you know replanting and all that but this for this obviously gained an impact with and been cut down now I just want to be clear and that the mitigation and green wall which I think is this is so essential that what that that the quality of the plants there are going to be up to the standard that we would expect and then on the overshadowing now I we've got parks I've got to talk of house and on house on on the other side it's it's clear I know that those on the ground floor of really got the facing a walk get that but if you're gonna have big building there is going to bring in less light into those gonna affect people in higher felt left as sunlight report says that that is as far as I can tell there that the there appears to be some kind of breach of the guidelines there and can use of help us with that a bit and and explain how that's being mitigated against her for the people living on on Park site
thank you
can if I may and so out of the first question which was arm playspace so either all their proposal is provison 235 square metres of playspace theory of the ground floor ward will be aimed at younger children to give them a chance to play and be at one of the nature there on the rooftops will be available to all range an all ages so the way that the applicant has designed a Rhys reversed hubs
give them a range of areas to play run around and use of their criminal will be that to to use other pay so an intense of the provision we did consider that they did comply with the requirements and they actually providing over and above what was required and replied using the GLA concussions data so officers are satisfied that days younger children and or young adults are not being pushed out are and having to look elsewhere but they also have also access to some of the other areas which are available to them around the application site on
on the roofs of access we have looked into it and we have asked the applicant to consult with secure by Design Officer and they have advised us that for security purposes it is better to keep separate access but if Members I don't see that as viable we could ask the applicant to I carry out further assessment to to Breedy demonstrate that this is an al iron not appropriate and it was old in some security concerns I but the initial an so advised that has been a given by secure by Design that officer was that they had some concerns about but I'm sure the that that the applicant would be willing to agree to additional condition requested the requested empty really demonstrate that sorted
Jefferson 0 sorry could send Tony Michael please
I I get the sense that a number of members would want you by the end of the meeting if we minded to grant this permission to draft as a condition that does secure that the children in rented units in affordable units of whatever nature they are
are not segregated from the children in purchased you that's I think a number of Members will feel quite strongly about that and once it secured by condition without the support the applicant says they want really
so so perhaps you could you or an Michael could be ready with something in case we do decide to floss for that OK sorry I trust you carry on may only speak we can it's civil interesting or we might have tea maybe lever to later on just to make sure that we as she capture and what the condition the property but this is something that we can deftly adds
moving on to the traffic and there are a number of areas said pan on acts as a Highway Officer and Transport for London did not raise concerns with the access mainly because an the development will actually result in less
vehicle movement coming in and to decide and the reason for that is currently the existing side has a number of car parking spaces
I say that there's quite a significant number that car parking is available along the western boundary and and there's some spaces in one-off the proposed development was only half free car parking spaces and DEIS car-parking spaces will be designated for disabled Blue by cheeses so people who are working in a commercial building would not be able to arrive to the site by a car I equally residents would not have the ability to to path at car parking permit which will mean that there is a reduction in vehicles in undersides are the applicant is also encouraging that they have I've worked quite hard felt for that are the Internal approaches to the site accessible that there's a range of different ways in which Rome residence could enter and lead to to the houses and evil Siblot at proximity to other modes of transport and whether it's allowed and a lot of Sir facilities and services are within walking distance
and what I we have also done a we have added two conditions would require a require the applicant to submit travel plan for both residential and commercial use which will further investigate and how people can be encouraged to travel to and from work by a sustainable transport safe for those reasons we didn't see and that the narrow access to do so would be an issue
in terms of the deliveries and servicing at the African has prepared a report which shows how the number of and delivery that could be expected by Brefi says and the author have designed a cider over the site with an opportunities for cars going into blips of loading areas or waiting areas to give an each other opportunity
to be able to leave or enter the site depending on what they're doing so that have been fought free adds the Vive those aspect have been checked by a highways as last year fell and he did not see that and as a concerned we also securing some feather information for planning conditions to ensure that this will be carried out appropriately
on the ecology yes are there will be some loss of trees on the western boundary but I have mentioned my presentation the overall the application will actually result in a net gain in biodiversity and the planting that will be provided will be closer to will be expected to find in a single Aquarius 0 will actually improve not just an surf Tree of about biodiversity in and around the site and all support existing saying Asseri whilst there is a loss which is regrettable we do feel that stat has been appropriately mitigated and we have added conditions which required the applicant to submit further details on
04 exact tree planting location and Sir species of the plants and trees that will be planted and we also ask them to provide 5 implementation and so we believe that that has been appropriately mitigated
her and I trust that this sort of covers Oldham points but it was missed anything let me know but I'm Skinner quickly move to day and suddenly we can pick up Odense with the guy said they are the sunlight
I'm sorry I say that just in building the waded designed it at there's a number of entrances and walkways and corridors which are located at the rears though a lot of the bedrooms and kitchens and any rooms that are facing towards the application site are already overshadowed both existing corridors so a lot of those rooms I expect the lower or levels of the land sited will expect an order developments I am
we studied the plans of their preferred building and all of those flats are two aspects so whilst are awesome bedrooms at which I overshadowed the addition of the building with these existing conditions which not result in such a change that will be noticeable to those rooms and also they have other areas of the sandwich are available to them which do benefit from better they had become state that to face of the from way I'm and so that is an said the reasons why are we felt that we can support this application
OK
I see from your might please cause on getting of getting feedback of my voice coming through it every time I talked about headphones later
as I covered everything you think you were asking Kassabova
the land that it does for the moment on my utmost to find the span of that bit those certainly term issues I High want to come back to it nobody else gets there first on lead and that that the whole tenure neutrality thing about the range of affordable housing in the spur outcomes in later by I've got Councillor shake and then Councillor Carrick and then Councillor Fuller
wanting to ask questions so I'm going to try and get you to take those together a few can thrive if too many seem to fall the whole or stop the even by her Councillor share you go next please thank you and it's just got three questions try make quick with them at the first learn bills and Councillor Walsh's at question around and maybe passes mental you can ask me to chair not the kind of tenure blind aspect of the development and I think the Committee I'm unsure is quite keen to ensure that and as an affordable rent and apartments are not inhibited and accident accessing any other part of the development and but I would apps Wonder's into might be up for going further I mean pepper potting is something that the Committee I think many Members on the Committee worked on prior to joining the Committee as a way of ensuring that were there might be the best of intentions in the city if you will unaffordable to affordable housing in one look and private out or unaffordable and another block and never to be those gonna be some disparity in the quality of living conditions there and what they can access so I'd be quite keen to hear from you so Patsy thank you for that presentation about how we can work could be an
how we can know what the applicant to look at having earned it people
halted abortive pepper-potted so that between the two voting
thanks to and they could it could be a mixed questions about the blue badge parking arms this 3 spaces am and I just wanted to open up again competition commit about whether we think that love nothing disabled people make up roughly about 20 percent of population in the UK and I mean 3 spaces as sort of under 5 percent of those who might be accessing our housing here so I just wondered we think that's enough
upper middle and thirdly this this building on Councillor this at question about are you mentioned that there had been L arm rings me in a controlled parking zones around the Beckmesser's initial it
woking has become a burden for residents in the area I didn't quite catch what exactly those the details of that arrangement have been if you could start to see more of Mitchell nut thank you
OK thank you sir Caterham Apache as she I'll go to change my mind and as as a council checks are several questions I've got ask if you could address those first before you do I just want to supplement them because she had she has hit on a couple of the same issues that I was going to and with with with regard to the tenure blindness and the why I was going to phrase that his ask you what I'm from knowing what our what our policies are
with and those are still developing and emerging obviously I was going to ask what attempts to be made to negotiate with the Africans towards than unaware as Councillor shaky that Stevie social housing partners and are often the the parties in this that express a preference for segregating the housing that they're managing for reasons that they know which can't fix their training on which there's their lighting and all of those things
but it is possible to do it pepper-potted him and if that's not possible then the second besties to take steps to absolutely ensure that that tenure neutrality is maintained but those are to do with conditions about how the see the building is managed after its occupied SOS go ask you first of all what will attempt to be made to negotiate with the applicants to achieve that sort of distribution of the social housing and secondly hell the tenure neutral maintenance of the social housing was going to be was going to be maintained by conditions and conditions measures but I think that she supplementing cecchini's question said could you could you cover those first please before we go on to council the current
yes of course say intensive pitiful thing that we have with my heart of the applicants on the of Austin to test with an I'll be possible
this I would like to say that there is no policy requirement to do that but we do know that this is an issue that is coming up and we wanted to make sure that the applicant has done everything at 2 to show to us and demonstrated this is not possible so the way they have done and they have approached a number of an our peace when the the what the when they were developing the scheme and they've clicked acquire laughing
I love that information is provided an officer reports they if I'm they have I contacted an API such as Phoenix Community Housing client and Hexagon save on quite a lot of big players and I am in fields and the feedback that were gaining from them it was about pepper potting was that it no ashy something not I I
officers are looking for and design of the building due to the difficulties with maintenance
the submitted information that we receive from the applicant and their research and we have of Arthur housing to look at it and it has been confirmed that Pep reporting of the Furnival housing units will make it difficult to get an appeal bought and and the housing team of having reviewed the the IPS application proposals and fans are satisfied that the proposed development is the right approach I am in terms of the quality of the accommodation the applicant and has worked very hard on assuring nuts at favourite son internal design of the proposal is no different and are by far I both blocks of high quality you've seen from a stood my presentation that stay there is already a difference in appearance of external piece of the building and great care has been taken to ensure that this is the same internally and so having reviewed olden from Ishant the submitted in regards to pepper potting and ensuring that the development will be tenure blind officers are satisfied that I am they they and their bit and that the building has been well designed with with the true intentions to to be tenure bland blind
on the disabled car parking spaces I am the TEFL has not I Highways I am have not raised any concerns with the number of car-parking spaces they are she thought it encouraging surf
also provisions where possible and they did and once a cask to dominate the up the scheme and Opik over Terfel in particular way aware I am pleased with the Director of the current design of the proposal and they did not raise concerns with with the provision of at the people and car-parking spaces and own the comments that were raised about a measures that will be taken to ensure that I'm people I'm not going to be
Sir adding to parking pressure in a local area the applicant will be signing a Section 6 Agreement with us which will prevent any residents and to tenants of the commercial building asking them not to obtain car parking permits so that's one of the measures which will be at deploying to ensure that we wouldn't be adding to car-parking they're car-parking stress and you want to be purchasing or looking to purchase or rents space I'm or flat any will be aware of this and and we believe that are those two things combined was sure that this development would not result in additional parking stress in the local area we will also be asking the applicant admission before 2 p submitting travel plans for both residential and commercial uses which will further encourage people to use sustainable motored on most of transport on we also believe that due to the location and proximity to services and facilities in their would really be needs and an that that so the proximity to those services have been detailed in a transport plan and there is a lot of services that are within walking distance and in accordance with the London Plan healthy streets are approach
but can I believe I've covered majority of the principal as anything else
there is no Cam happy to see Cuba before I give it back to you Champ I think Kafka Councillor Walsh made an comments in in the chance about the facilities in in a place this provision
blogSarah I'll let you I'm
I think that having reviewed the application we were satisfied that while there are any specific Sir of areas for them there does still opportunities for them to use and the way the the playspace designed to serve slide and and have some 5 fun in an imaginative way so officers believed that at the scheme has been well designed and but if you are not satisfied we could add a condition asking to to for the applicants to relook at the play space and how its design so and we can often to introduce some fun elements and a specific facilities am fall for the surf I older age group
Lord
I like the concept for a planning condition specifying the about a farmer will level provide for I think it probably birth unfeasible sounds a bit sobia I do think we could specify I am sure there is a condition requiring the applicant to submit details of landscaping and the the day the details of how that a place will be finished I'm sure we could at least make it explicit that we want those details to include how it will provide for children and young people of different age ranges and Socratic could be modified to to make sure it explicitly mentions that and Blackwell Haynes or cover it at least right and I'm going to ask Councillor Karon if he can put his questions I suspect he might have several tone and I'm not quite sure how they might annoy you want to draw attention to the the Tree Officer able to be looked at in detail look quite sure some say Michael ahead the handy if he can Patricia limb the closures Rumens churn
can you hear me and I can't and only as you intimated only had sight of the tree officer's report today and the once aware on the maths on the subjects that can I ask that we see these in full in future because and whilst I appreciate of Sasu their best to summarise these reports the summary in our our agenda doesn't faithfully match the tree officer's report so jaded than in terms of that that generality of our access to fling Leyshon I have got a meeting arranged and on Friday now with the with with the director of planning and couple of other officers about how that works in general high wall put on the table there sorry he hadn't routinely possible in future
OK thank you Chair just just to be sure I don't know if other Members half that report in front of as we received it today I shared it on a WhatsApp group if they haven't they want to have a look at it but I'm just going to frame my question in the context of the points that the Tree Officer made her own one is that it provides a very important trees so there's going to be I think 36 trees chopped down 36 mature trees which is an incredible amounts and
it says it that's great you're provides any green infrastructure between the wooded Site of importance for nature Conservation which is adjacent to and the tree area to the north as well
it affects the setting of Beckley to conservation area it screams its islands of the rear of the blocks of flats and breach of place it contributes to the importance her treat hospital setting for the brain injury recovery Centre
and it amongst other items so I just more it reduces air pollution from the heavily trafficked aid to now those who know the area the 82 never stops it's constant the traffic you know it's one of the key routes through Lewisham in London
and Chair I want to know King officers say that the replacement trees are going to carry out the same
function of the trees that can be lost not just air quality but fed up I diversity in habitat then I don't I really don't see how removing the creature's habitats is actually going to improve it so someone knocked down my home it's not improving it so I think we need to establish that but on the day that one of Lewisham's residents who lives lived adjacent to the south SERC on a busy roads
we find that the coroner says that she died as a direct result of poor air quality it was a major contributory factor and here we are chopping down 36 trees that the Tree Officer says contributes to air quality on one of the major arterial roads for Lewisham so my my question is
does she think the Tree Officer is correct and should be sacked start any store by
OK Pat Patsy at Tavern address that one or address the questions in that one if you could please
for Apple I were then I was the pen or try and answer that
County Councillor current
they are fully acknowledged that the trees the mega contribution to the area however bows tree on that particular boundary are not protected and it's always going to be a challenge when you're looking at you know sites where we have housing targets and plans to provide new employment space so it is always a challenge trying to now find the way fitting all of these things in so all the loss of those trees is is regrettable there is the ability to replace them so with this scheme what we have is a net gain in biodiversity which has been confirmed by the Council's Ecologist and were able to do with part of a landscaping scheme is where able to directs the most appropriate species and the most appropriate size of new trees that can be most beneficial in terms of ecology and environment
we have no control over what's doubt minutes and understanding as that lots of it are self-seeded had been let them and been left over time fit with they a new landscape scheme the Council would have full control over bots me planting those in the
Land it to you ought to have a police follow up to that year's again when you destroy habitat you can't replace him the creatures that actually lived there now who lose that and the base order different bird varieties and the rest of it
and it's not a nice nice things to have all these things are interlinked supports ecology in in Lewisham but what I'm going to fall back on share is the tree officers coming so it's looking about trees and I'm looking at the tree officers comments and the Tree Officer says their inadequate the felling of all 36 trees will you know Leeds in poor air quality and and have a major impact
only psychologically air quality amenity all the things that trees do and they provide shelter
and biodiversity and we have got a climate change policy and I take the how where following that by destroying one of the key thing so what I want to say is I'm not against development per in hope completely I just the me I just think this must be to intense if it's damaging her or sites adjacent to site importance for nature conservation and removing key wooded areas from one of the busiest arterial routes in Lewisham and the Tree of society contribution her content so ongoing society by that point well I hadn't gone right for you got our attention to the detail of that and I think they would we've we've got to accept that it's a balance we got up with people going to form a judgement about that hopefully by the end of
this process tonight and we got upset that that obviously that there is some disruption to ecological environments as well as all sorts of things but people's these inquire in the process of development and we've got to balance that against that the leave the housing hand in many cases the me for development in areas of the pSPA I think you
he made the point I don't I don't think there was another question that I can try Norse planning officers to responsive in that are gonna go on I think the that that the next UK was Councillor Clarke
Susanna thank you have questions to pose to 1 of the Planning officers yes and I was wanting to follow on from that because after having been read the tree officers at the report I was really quite deeply troubled because we seem to but trees are last in the balance every single time regardless Musil well Development and Housing always comes first well I would I get she a comment from the officers on the amenity value of trees as well because there have a very significant amenity value and the corridor of trees right in front of a set of flood that people have lived with for years and when we're talking about mental health issues and affecting the country there's nothing more than greenery and trees that actually provide a sense of security and beauty of surrounding your area and that is very very important to people and we haven't actually touched on the amenity value of these trees we've talked about the ecological value and that's clear and that would be lost and it's obviously not influence is is there a question does quite well a number 1 was the amenity value her that has not says doesn't seem to have been covered in this clearly the other area that I was going to ask about was the actual planting on site is individual trees and this is a corridor of trees which is a wholly different aspects than just individual trees being planted and when you say you replacing them it says on page 47 semi mature and established you can't replace with an established trees with established trees these are new trees going in and I usually have a limited height and of limited benefit their take time to establish so I was wondering why the why we were calling them a semi mature I can understand but established I was confused by
and the third point I was going to ask about was we've talked about a green wall but actually that doesn't recreate the pollution value that are that a tree mitigates for the pollution around it but green walls don't so we haven't actually mentioned that either and one other a question was on the hospital the impact on the hospital of course greenery this is actually neurological care and brain injury unit and on page 60 I just wasn't clear about the impacts upon the hospital because it says that day like result sure the proposed development 29 02 49 windows would comply and so I was wondering you know their windows that don't comply but it's not clear to me the full impact of the development on the hospital site so there's a number of elements there that I'm very uncomfortable with particularly the loss of a corridor of trees that links in a horseshoe shape to these back of a sink site as well which could create a corridor for insects animals birds and the like so I've got some very serious concerns over this thank you Chair bar on his tone of gratefully what your questions
sorry there were several questions their number one was the sorry I'd I'd listed them hadn't ID or amenity value we haven't actually mentioned the amenity value to the flats that are back onto the trees and I didn't think that was clearly put in the report is very much ecologically Best but not on the amenity value to the people from the flats and I don't think that's really put very strongly in this report
the second question was on the when we're saying we putting established trees into the site are not clear what they mean by an established tree because I understood semi mature are reasonably small trees take time I she linked to that as many of these trees sometimes die of they can often die when a very young what would happen in that case we have a follow up as often these promise but actually don't come up the green wall isn't I asked about the pollution value from the Green while I know you're reading arise Chair but these things are quite important and I often get some meetings and residence or cut me short but never mind and the hospital site as well the impact on hospital site which was paid 60 which was a direct question so there were four specific questions or turn thank you
but the second-row not trying to cut your Shaw and don't read anything into my facial expressions please but we can we can only be fair to the officers by asking them questions that we can reasonably expect to answer Patsy or Michael cricket could you answer those questions just so we're clear about the nature of the replacement trees and the expectation of the green walls been described and any other comments you want to make on that please
shorter
in terms of fame amenity value of of the trees they are obviously thought amenity valley through that position in there
and their proximity to the to the units but this above officers was really papa planning balance in terms of weighing up a number of factors which is about doing of attention and NI placement of trees and landscape but the provision of new housing employment space and other things that scheme has to do so it is really part of balancing exercise and officers are of the view that given the benefits of the scheme and a replacement landscape
with no objection from the Council's Ecologist and that's the scheme is acceptable in planning terms I'm in terms of when young trees could die I appreciate young trees when the Atlantic and sometimes fail any sit all over then the all over the place we words need to secure a landscaping condition which requires a programme of maintenance firms are typically trees more than 5 years old road Aurora the strong enough to survive without much that much assets it's much younger trees that are prone to failure
so if there was a case where you had arm a landscape scheme and the trees were to fail and they wouldn't be replaced for then the five-year period and that means they have a chance to you know to grow and survive in terms of the green wall we don't have any information on pollution or anti-pollution valley enough or something that we have information on delicate must be able to assist you with that and then hostel site Patti you to take that one of the
thank you Michael
so the question about the hospital site and what what was that in relation to date and Old theming T and the impact to trees will also have on the hospital because I think our housing clear exactly what the question that was surge as one to clarify before I go into it yes thank you it was some two it was both aspects but particularly it says of the daylight results show that the development 29 out of 49 windows would come comply I wanted a firm you could please sort of tell me what which we just don't comply and who would be impacted as this patience is it because I know there's a different uses on the site some are by patients and some are not so and yes the amenity value as well I the overshadowing the height of the building in relation to the hospital
yet say when the applicant was preparing the Delos valid report there were able to obtain some of the panel from the hospital
and they faced ourselves to know that so the hospital system maybe on on the ground has one flaw at a lot of the rooms and that I serve located closer to decide or the having discounted as they haven't been taken to commercial because they were not serving as serve recovery rooms their use for other purposes and I guess the Africans consultant who go into lot would be more detail as we are sure the seemed a panel to hospital they just gave us to her so that the end a study and the this or provide us information and we had no other information to to serve go against that's
the daylight and centred on the results have shown as I see tell to in the report on page 60 and target 292 an is found a majority of the Windsors house would be complying say despite the fact that there were the would be a development happening or beyond the sides and the impact is not going to be an acceptable so those windows which are close as are most affected will still receive acceptable I level of the own sunlight
I'm not sure that actually answers your questions by Leeds could go into at more detail about that are lit and the applicant such speak on them all Kellett left us as one free B applicant is going to address any OFAC as well Planning officers if you if you could point us to Michael said I think that he's cover the condition about maintenance of planting already in the draft conditions proposed perhaps in the chap you could point us to the page or the condition number so members could make their own judgement about whether those those adequately other
what might happen I see neither indications from members of the Committee I want to ask one final question before we move on is fighter 9 we still have to hear from the African Any objects as yet so reaching a decision so that might might actually quite simple I I'm sure to in the report the could you just remind us in regard to the car-free nature of this development what's the P tell the public transport accessibility level of this site because I'm aware there obviously there are some bus routes on the A 2 but I don't imagine it's the highest
notation defies step he tells between 2 and 3 and but will the applicant has done they did the study about the acts for services and facilities in the vicinity so that is so taking into account the closer services within 20 minutes walk from the application site and that has been details and are fully covered in the supporting Transport theme and so for those reasons I am Brecon comfortably said that majority of the services all within walking distance and people be active able to access the despite the fact that's the pieces rented below I'm I also once I'd that there is a number of a buses which are available from around the site and the application is when I'm walking distance to number of as they shins which have access to I'm away and in some cases deal are so we redefine absent accessible and sustainable location
and
on the site can you can you confirm that we're requiring that the Blue badge car-parking spaces that we are specifying on the site are equipped for electoral vehicle charging destination charging 7 kilowatts ugly
and Kanye quickly double check and that's not Enderley Grimaud we can at that and to ensure parks or
that you could interpret certain putting an amendment or and out to make sure that amendment is effectively the appropriate condition again if Members are minded to agree that BP the make an outfit now rife I'm going to move straight on the saying is nearly nine o'clock we don't want to manage the pace of this meeting so on would like to hear from the Africans' next and I believe that been Spencer
is there a planning consultant Planning Advisor
or at the to introduce yourself properly be awful your title whatever if you want so annual so have a number of
consultants to the applicant on the hand in the meeting whom line the hukou you might need to help answer questions from members and I'm going to give you 10 minutes her and I will tell you when you got 30 seconds of that 10 minutes left you you are very welcome take lessons have minutes if you want so so tell us that he might be well picked up things that Members of asked in discussion with officers that he wants to address as well and so if you could do that please then haven't earned after we've had that time members might want to ask questions of YouTube until you gather the Finance said the floor is yours
I thank you chat and so moneys been sense on one of the founders of Jess 8 the applicant saw the end for the occasion and I suppose project in Lewisham we want to ensure that we deliver the type of development that would be represent us as a business and provide the local community will long lasting benefits the development would benefit from a pioneering carbon Nantie positive 0 waste construction framework and since the onset since our inception are approaches always been to take inspiration and guidance from the local community to ensure our scheme seamlessly integrate and add value to our neighbours local people and economies we hope that's been evidence by robust engagement included knocking on over 50 neighbours' doors before any design began and holding an early community workshop with 3 thousand invitation sent out to help understand what local people would want to see it delivered in the scheme
in terms of formal public consultation rather than a single meeting we held five targeted zoo meetings tailoring the presentation to each breach location to the site specific matters relevant to each group could be addressed with Kobe presenting challenges we still wanted to ensure the community had unfettered access to the application Team to address any concerns so throughout the process we offered continuous open engagement including a number of in-person meetings in a production of additional bespoke reports that neighbours request to provide comfort where needed
we have continued to develop an adjusted proposals where requested and possible including access improvements at the site
getting to the rear of the commercial facade to maintain a sense of natural of the neighbours and we were in open to our neighbours to ensure the development is mutually beneficial the can't sort composite 17 storage office and light industrial units built in the 19 80 s is generally underutilised out contacts the final proposals will deliver 63 apartments 37 percent of which affordable housing approximately 25 thousand square feet of flexible workspace representing a hundred temps and increase on current employment space
as an existing employment site was imperfect imperative to get the commercial offering right at the start of process to be created a commercial advisory group headed up by studio or a Local Enterprise Group and initiatives such as shape Lewisham and the Lewisham borough coach Ibarra culture bid their role was to ensure the space was designed would be suitable for local businesses and function in long term the outcome as flexible light industrial type workspace though provide a hub for local startups and creative industry businesses who also engage closely with the existing tenants of the estate offering relocations report and a first right of refusal to take any new space in the development
the management plan is proposed for the space would provide networking events and a monthly community market though provide both tenants and external local businesses a platform to showcase their work and products to the local community and a safe space for the local community to bond with new and old members we want to further encourage growth amongst our tenants and as such we're making a non recourse grant of 10 thousand pounds available to encourage business development in terms of design the commercial building has been developed to a 0 waste and energy positive where we were we use non contaminated materials from the existing site and the finished building and produce more energy from renewable sources net requires this will allow our tenants many of whom will be we expect to be small businesses to operate with greatly reduced overheads this phase would be flexible providing space for businesses to grow and provide an on-site cafe as well as internal and external loading
the residential element the scheme has been designed with a high quality brick facade and roof terraces that would provide useable space all year round will hold season or educational and community events for our residents and the local community alike we've worked closely with the council's housing team to ensure the Affordable affordable tenure mix is applicable to and directly addresses the needs of the Council's housing register within a 37 percent provision of affordable housing 70 percent is for rented accommodation
the upmarket apartments are targeted at local first-time buyers and young families in keeping with our company's ethos every every apartment has been designed to exceed London Plan space standards and will benefit from private amenity space and shared play spaces for both tennis all residents on development will also benefit from are you centre designed to encourage circular economy immense amongst residents allowing show play trade belongings and further strengthen the community as with a commercial building we're intending to generate all of our energy for the residential building through Noble sources including a ground source and air source heat pumps and photovoltaics for producing the building's heating and power in is so that residents can also enjoy lower utility bills we enlisted the help of award-winning landscape gardeners London glades to create a self sustainable ecosystem that will promote the growth of local wildlife and species and complement sinks surrounding our site on Ziming played by new planting of mature trees and shrubbery and I'll show the inclusion of existing law passed for example to retain habitats for local insects and other species that use the sink and surroundings
we are one of if not the market leader in sustainable development and as such were committed to long-term preservation of natural environments as part of that commitment will continue to manage the site including the maintenance and replacement of any large trees that require attention we've been speaking with a local ecologist who looks at imprint of the choice of planting to encourage local specious to the long-term the design produces a significant biodiversity gain of 18 percent and a net habitat increase of 100 78 SEN
this ultimately results in a net increase of 100 species on site the landscaping will include large areas of natural play space and areas foraging edible plant growth for use throughout the year so in summary we hope you can support our proposals for high quality new homes first time buyers and families and commercial space will provide purpose built workspace for local start-up businesses and development that we hope will set a new benchmark for data design and sustainability in Lewisham thank you
OK thank you very much for the river on your available time ha I just want to start off I think we heard from the Planning Officer that you had explored the option of pepper potting affordable that the different housing tenures in the development
I didn't want to start off by asking you and if there is anything you could do to encourage lack of segregation or discourage segregation I supposed between the what what there is a danger my my graph as two separate communities of the the Affordable residents and the the not-so affordable residence if you like as a simple way of classifying an Yves talked about various communal facilities that you want to develop but I wonder what you might do that's positive to try and tackle the risk of that happening which her as as you will have heard concerns a lot of us and concerns us in the Council and had them tight but only by other Members interesting questions
chaired limit on an hour wait for other major yes get flee pleased if you could just tackle that sort of tenure segregation issue Festival and what you what the the developer might be able to do about that if it's Grant said I think that that would separate help a great deal stones and so we we have explored this quite sensibly and including speaking to over 8 Mr. providers plus the Council's housing teams I'm in terms of what we are directly doing on site and to it to encourage us we've got a shared and play space on the ground floor there is for kids and children for our any tenures on the developments we've also got effectively a I join entrance on the ground floor the although it provides to separate entrances is the is is completely attenuated tenure neutral sense of design and the only reason the we've been and current given down that road is because the housing associations always and have a request or fear of having to share service charges with their with a block that they don't controls the the kind of community benefits or elements of the scheme such as the re-use Centre are again tenure neutral their use by both them their residence of the affordable housing and also that the private housing and the the Community events that were planning to hold both the marker and also the educational events on on the roof spaces are open to all residents not just not just private residence but we were always open for for suggestions and happy to continue to work with with the local authority and with with the registered providers on this issue as anything the that we can do to further enhance that
but I think you are Council Olivier you you but some question I know you you also Melvin facilitating some of this consultation with local residents yet
thank you Chair nuts right femur we've had various meetings public meeting but various
of meetings since then Mr. Spencer joke of a few points it's wanted to Treasury some of you've you've we've we've touched on before us we get your take on it so on access no we we've heard that actually yes fine or residents not going to be able to have their own vehicles there but the officer talked a bit about as she said that if the be less traffic coming in because because there are few pop car parking spaces anyway and cars would be bucket but my concern really is more about you've got a lot more individuals on the site understandably because that suited for putting it more out of the site but eat those individuals are going to have their delivery needs and what I want to be assured of is you know how we can the loading areas that you have victim pass each other what I wouldn't want a logjam building up blocking at the hospital and going out on to a very busy road as it is so that's that's my first question I've also got another question is time about overlooking onto the hospital site so obviously we've got patients there you've got outdoor facilities out my concern there is I just want to make sure that and overlooking residential side is properly there's probably protections or screening of some kind on that and then there's this issue about the the greening on the the wall of the the the business block because the Tree of support set says year there's no there's no screen must be some kind of
so it is taken as read that will now be green screening but I want you know I you've touched your introduction Spencer a bit about about your gonna be replacing treason I've heard Councillor current say as you know you can't replace habitat overnight and I get that and it's balancing exercise but I want to be sure if we're not going I don't want just scraggly ivy leaves has going up this were really wanted to to actually be pretty substantial what assurances can you give on that and my last question is is to do with ventilation heating it's for that the results are going to move in I've got my fellow Councillors and Amanda I consider Campbell who report attending this meeting as well and all of us have been but the heavy gauge Parkside where the central central heating Assistant there just was not fit for purpose particularly for the block facing at the 82 I want to be sure that I don't want residents to open their windows when it's too hot in the summer which is what people in parts I'd have to do what what protections have we got fought for residents in the new block and you don't bear ago had been spent
just just a continuity are ours to them in order of that's OK and with regards to access of actually got the David fears for his our transport consultant on the call from counterpart and Hakan deferred to him he better answer more detail them the myself Davide the
yes I am talking about everybody having stood I'm so to answer all question Kevin and the number of deliveries are expecting to the future development will be around 25 across the day and that accounts for both the residential and commercial aspects that's been calculated using industry standard methodologies which was accepted by by Terfel and Lewisham's Highway officers and across those 25 deliveries we expect no more than 4 within a peak hour so across the entire hour you'd expect for vehicles we have to loading areas so in terms of whereas the congestion along the access road and and the fact that we are limited to three car-parking spaces I think in fact you'll find that the access road is empty for longer than its occupied by vehicle and that's purely because
through the delivery Management Plan that will also be implemented so the management team on site will be looking to effectively have deliveries in off-peak hours so when residents and the commercial units or users of those or not travelling along the access road
and
added to answer their questions and answers or diameter elaborate on anything roads just quickly on axis I mean it does not take account of the fact that more people are Karney work from Oman that may continue no post pandemic and you know that I suddenly noticed as this more deliveries coming into my blood Olivant a block of as his 45 and I'll answer anything is more than four an hour at the moment so so I just want to
does the assumption but how can you how can you plan for things exceeding assumptions I just want to be sure that if if that's your assumptions is exceeded that actually there is still room for vehicles to move around
yeah that's good question and actually what we found year on year is that the number of deliveries that residential accommodations receive is increasing and so the GOP the comparison between 5 years and now is that it's very difference and that is because of your Amazon deliveries and that's been factored in and understood that actually what you have a lot of Amazon delivers a lot of those are consolidated off site before they're delivered so it's not one delivery vehicle per package it will be several packages per vehicle so in terms of the actual overall number of deliveries coming on site and I don't actually think there would be a massive increase based on the 25 delivers we've set out and
but if they were what my point is just as well I can and let such as all five yet so we actually did analysis of capacity within the loading locations and so the two loading locations based on the peak hour and we're looking at around a 40 percent occupancy and that's because of the length of the loading areas so the loading areas can actually take more than one vehicle within each of them so there is actually innate capacity built in
OK I covered what you're asking calving I've got a Khalsa shake next so I never just other just I think I'll be more up said customer there was a choice first point thanks the second point with regards to overlooking to the to the hospital and so we as as part of our engagement we we met with the hospital and continue discussions and this was a point that came up and what we've agreed is that we can screen and the main point of concern as the the roof terrace on the on the open market block and to we've agreed to to screen that to that frontage so they're all residents were door by users of the roof terrace would look towards the same can away from the hospital aside from that they're there weren't any we don't have any real concerns and as far as I'm aware hospital to of of overlooking in terms of quality of planting and and I understand in a some of these are green walls look grey on a CGI but they take years to get there because of the choice of planting we very much advocates or installing planting and green walls and an anything of the like that that look like they're intended to from day one and that's and then that would be maintained throughout the period of our ownership of this the estate which would be for perpetuity you know at least for the for the very long term but I'm very happy for that to be conditional and and for that to be a condition the you know the council need to approve any installations like that and any planting so the so there will be full visibility and transparency and it's not just us you know I'm promising something that we don't deliver and then that that the fine was regarded overheating so there there's a number of sustainable features that we've introduced about the conifer in a lot of it starts with the fabric of the buildings so you know if we've got a number of different design features include generic exposed concrete screed that that will provide thermal mass you know we've got MVA China mechanical vent heat recovery ventilation systems you know we've got intensive blue roofs which shade and insulate the the upper floors and and you know there's there's just a number of different Conte design features along those lines that that we've introduced in order to to reduce the overheating of buildings and we actually carried out an overheating study and which we do as part of of sustainability study in and forms part of that to that process so I have some has been something that's been well considered and there's climbed of data and scientific evidence to back that up so we can prove if necessary
her cry sorry have I ever
I'm not covered riffing off now right OK Serena your go now I'm thank you Chair
officers would say really pleased to hear about the details on the depth of consultation that you described working with the Ward Councillors as enacting what we want to encourage the notion of the way of a I'm the yet consulting I guess my question I think to has already spoken to a little bit more about the community that yet to come so again this idea at this conversation around tenure blind as I just wondered if we could look a little bit about it of the officer at the mentioned that it was mostly because they are peas went very encouraging of the idea of having it had offered after although none of them from what I understood said it was impossible and I know that obviously developments do have pepper potting and also won over conversation I guess not conversation as such but the idea that you know where in the chain of events that we begin to create a culture where we expect that in Lewisham from of development and I think perhaps some pressure from yourself on the appeal and might go some way in achieving that and also putting off his who and maybe do that another development the things are members of the Committee or members of the Committee this important that its own Alex I don't think I could fill confident in this development knowing that there would be separated no common on their intentions I think the best of intentions and I'm pleased to hear the processes you have for mitigating against any ad deferred experienced residents that it never put me on his people committed to building on suggested to me that's me on that please
so with Adult so that the pitiful thing as I mentioned in a way we're very happy to explore and and Kanye support however we can in introducing this to to took more widely to developments in the barren and and further
I think you know is is sometimes difficult and hard enough negotiating river with the are pays at the best of times and in I if if there is a joint effort between our son and the local authority to try and move past some of their concerns about bought pepper potting of the units you know particularly with regards to management and service charges than we're very happy to work with you on that
yasmina I I'm not sure what else I can say is other than the in a way we're very happy to to to offer support and to work with the Council on that I'm just stir
just now it's an uphill battle but would be definitely up for the 5 F if you want us alongside you
I I thought I was going to say that I mean I I think I think we've we probably probe the the possibility of different arrangement
we've heard the developer's intentions I think this is a I am we've been advised by Planning officers I think the key not yet formally included in our policy set not something we can require I do think it's a conversation that we should initiate of preps get the the cabinet member responsible the Housing and Planning Councillor Bell to to lead on and what he needs to do is get a number of the registered providers who are active in the Borough around the table because it does seem that they are the partners who are often preventing this happening rather than just the developer who comes to us for planning permission
but I think we heard from the Planning option and we heard from the applicant on this the I appreciate you probing it as far as we can and you you wanted it or follow us so on format on something else yes please Chan thank you I think that's actually bring an idea to get the cabinet member council about an inch of could amount to around the office took out there Smith just even that we've had forced coming onto from the applicant and willing to work with officers and turning a two-pronged effect because I want to bring us back into this concession and us given that we have a green light from the developers of thing aquatic on this what can we now do so not with a step B from officers perspective in pushing this forward to there was a combined hash from local 31 of the applicant
OK well I am happy to park there and let's this gives the officers after we finish with the applicant and the objectors please when we get into general discussion of this and they can tell us whether there is anything they can do to to conditional or or making recommendations they got in front of us for this application but I think it's more general question
her last one on suggesting the need to tackle it as a more general question as well thank you to the Africa officer if you could note that we would like to but we'd like to bring up on back OK I've got Councillor Gibbons next their vice chair my cookery became uncle or got a couple of questions
50 about the nature of the sites of allocation firstly bought amenity decent the current site office
in my personal view it's not exactly an urban meadow or would with a right of way enjoyed by old is a low density fairly unattractive some industrial space so comparatively what amenity space does Dylan Bellemare and offered to the area as a pundit what's currently there and on the particular constrictions of this site and in your opinion would any viable development in this area leads a loss of several large trees and then what length said you taken to him being a being aware of that at what link to view taken as the Atkin to improve by the thirsty on the site
OK Spencer for while ago
he I think can I think in terms of their initial question regarding what is the current SCI offer in terms of amenity get your right that very little indeed no they're they're the row of trees that are there at the moment and an overly access at all may need due to the the large change in level and and and because of the use of their the size but Donnelly an industrial sites so I think you know we we've looked her to effectively creates a more integrated offering with the sink and to complement and enhance the sink rather than than the tract of immense and I think he notes
with with the the huge level of for increased biodiversity we have on site and ultimately leading to a in a significant increase of of species and wildlife from from the proposed landscape designer I think we've gone some way towards that and any terms of the the loss of the large trees we always look her retention as as the first port of call and by it was determined by our ecologist and or so by our landscape gardeners who Robin and scape architects the inner sit in an office and and draw you know plans for landscape they're they're actually gardeners are heartened they really they install the planting and manage the planting themselves so I think now that we have explored all of those options it it's it's never our first-choice to to get rid of trees but a lot of them approved to be of of a lower quality than than you know the then could be retained so that that kind of led to our to our thinking and the reason why in a way we haven't retained any of them on site by what we have done is retained portions of some of the dead logs and and some of these shrubbery that that can be retained and reused in the existing also in the proposed development as as new habitats
OK
to recommend what you're asking low
yes the RHI OK I've got Councillor Clarke MEC
thank you Chair and justifying on from that last conversation when you said there's no amenity value that goes up severely against our own tree officer's report which says the significant amenity value as stands from a number of different aspects if every more if their members and the Isle obviously you would have read that report so I don't could you comment on the amenity that our Tree Officer because I have great respect she's a very very good tree officer and I very much respect her point of view and it's very clear that she has deep concerns about this and when you say the trees are not of standard that's not what she reports and the first reaction of our Ecology Officer also reported that I need to point that out because members would be
not given the full information if they saw the immediate Our reaction which is in no one of the reports from our Ecology Officer that did said that there was a value to this site and the other thing is when you say you you're a sustainable organisation you you'll be aware of the urban deforestation problem the problem or taking out corridors of trees and bit by bit taking away green is greenery and though you say you're adding it and you're leaving a few logs leaving logs outside a natural environment doesn't actually work as you know it has to be within a corridor or an environment not just pepper potted around the site so I'd like you to make a few comments on those please and I also you heard me talk about the hospital I wonder if you could give a little bit more feedback on the hospital site and I wanted to know about your conversations with the hospital you appear to be sort of saying that they're happy now with the development and earth and I wondered if there any other thoughts on that the question that Cern Councillor Barnaby abroad of about the use of the units when you talking about deliveries for example are you controlling the usages of the units how would they be actually
monitored because if you had the set for example an online store there you'd have deliveries every five seconds you know if it was used for that type of thing so I was wondering what the whether there's any limits on the usages and the noise levels and the limits on the timings of these commercial units concern I have read the report thoroughly but I can't remember through a timings around that and there was one other thing I was sorry to the entrance the GLA brought of some issues about the problems at the entrance area of different usages pedestrians cars and all sorts of different uses I wonder if you could comment on the GLA feedback and the last one was you mentioned 37 percent affordable housing I can't pitch 33 was 31 percent I'm a bit confused between the 31 and 37 percent on page 33 if he could clarify on that please
I respect that
other with all the points that I can answer in one of our deferred to a to David Pearce for the transport I response I mean in terms of the the ecology in the tree point I would have hoped to how far our collagist here tonight Barn fortunate he's Sir he couldn't make it I can't admit I'm men an expert in this field and so I can't give you probably as comprehensive answers as you would like so I'm I'm only going on on you know the advice that I'm given and you know the advice that we've been given by our colleges is to the contrary of the tree officer and I I understand there's there's differences there and and that's something there's there's been contested throughout the application but my understanding was the we'd reached a point the because of the intensification of landscaping and chanting
bring on site and the proposed scheme and the on balance it was it was regarded as a as a positive for for the site in terms of the hospital site yes we have had conversations I've met the Director of the Hospital personally myself I wouldn't go as far as saying they're happy with the development but you know we we've certainly made efforts to to address all of their concerns and no there there is an ongoing dialogue and work continually open to that ongoing dialogue to do whatever we can to to to ensure this as has leased little impact at your idea benefit particularly with regards to tidying up the entrance to the site and with regards to the overlooking and by certainly wouldn't say that they're they're happy with the development I can't speak on their behalf perspective that I am in terms of the the noise levels in the timings of the commercial building so the commercial building internally will be will be well insulated and subsequently the neighbours will have no or little to no exposure to any of the noise is created by any of the businesses internally in in in terms of in a working hours there they'll be are owed imagine typical you know 8 am until 6 or 7 pm or at the latest and we can control that with a management of the building so that any works that are noisy or that would potentially cause disruption to neighbours have to remain internally you know after it OK before and after certain hours in the same for deliveries and because because will be controlling the sire I'm will have a poor to on site controlling deliveries and we can manage and we can advise tenants particularly in lease agreements that they only permitted to have deliveries between certain hours of the day and we can stagger that to to to avoid congestion and then with regards to the GLA or so I'll just address that you the affordable housing point and I'll hand over to David for the for the transport points I refer to 37 percent by habitable room and which I believe is the the principal method of measuring the the quantum of affordable housing the local authority I'm adopted so apologies if there was any confusion I I may wish to mention by habitable room but that that's what I was referring to so hopefully I just to appoint so if I missed anything Byrne David if he if you are mundane with the GLA points and the the entrance issues
the government and so at the initial feasibility and a stage and working with the GLA the the entrance was of the kind of key point of the the whole discussion and that that the real reason for that is that the site doesn't have any footway provision entering the site from Blackie till at present so one of the key aspects of this design is to introduce a separated footway into the site and that was presented to the July and was seen as a positive I think what we then did was go a step further following further discussions with the July about the interaction with the crossover onto and Blackett health so it was agreed to implement a raised table at this point and the reason for a raised table is and what this does a few points it now it reduces the speed of vehicles entering and exiting the site it also makes vehicles aware when turning into the site of the presence of pedestrians on entry and it also prioritises pedestrians when passing by that then ties in with the new footway provision and that we're providing along the western boundary which widens out further to the south as the as the the site widens out naturally
OK thank you very much for diving Ben I've got one more Member the quickly indicating questions the applicant I'm going to wrap that up then
the first half 9 30 now and how OK and and I are sorry our scams the current becoming mix with the questions and then Councillor Bombardier indicates he's got another very quick question and then I am going to terminate questions for the applicant we still haven't heard from the objectors yet
so
having oversight Liam Gallagher first-place thank you Jim atoning and he used say the owner improving the ecology on the site I find that really hard to believe more than hard to believe it seems victim contradiction to the report of what the Tree Officer saying so you're actually chopping down 36 trees and completely removing the linear green corridor which is adjacent to a Site of importance for nature Conservation and sites are adjacent to what the are views are short had a sink
are very important for sustaining all that wildlife and it also provides a green card or to the point
the area across on the hill and as the tree officer states in a ribald so and it you say it's local it can you define what are low quality trees in your your opinion because it is going to be important to the application
that Kate been well I've got a couple more Chris I just wanted that cannot on low quality trees yes so my limited understanding apologies is is that the trees have her have a grading and CASC rates and if if they graded below a certain category than they're not they're not deemed as as good enough quality for retention and I believe that was the the grading that was awarded to the trees in order for you with the coming to replace of Apollo logs and by definition looks at the lowest quality of trees available firm because the date and so are cutting down a green wall of trees the actually provide a king they refine the carbon nitrates that come of the to they actually feel to them and take them out of the air and this is today something that we know Kildare young girl of the South Circular coding to the coroner and now we're going to remove a huge site of a green corridor adjacent to this so I can't see how it take a largely better the next thing I would say is you do say that your designs are good night I'm glad to doing it and I think I've any quibble with that the you know your reducing people Ristic but by definition a trees or keep poems cool in summer and warm in winter they protect them and this is a complete blanket of trees
that exists now that protecting nature and neighbour to cut them all down and replace them with dotted ones around the site by definition so I I have to challenge your point though it's an improvement her far from it and finally also another thing that the Tree Officer roads is the the removal of those trees new building up to the site of the sink much closer to the site of importance for nature Conservation means there will be pressure on the site importance for nature Conservation
to have the 0 the trees that are dominating over those buildings to be removed because they will be threatening the buildings because the buildings are much closer so Hova rule I think it scores the minus on the ecological scoreboard at every level and I do think that it to me does seem an over intensification of a site where you could actually build less but you need we need these trees to start I'd say that South boring Uno lay in my life I get your point entirely had and family again the having went we're not here to have a debate with the African
it is getting late so
during this part of the process asked some questions that elicit more information now EDAG no ECC Mr. Spencer's as a divine the question within that that he was so answer then Arlene bite him to now that I'm going to go to the quick factual I hope question the Council of Olivier's got and then and gonna move to the Save the me against his OK Mr. Spencer yes just quick response and so EMI induction to the locks other lot passes dirty provider habitat for for insects and other species and we arched planting as I mentioned before mature trees so not not saplings so there will be somewhere Wretch intending to to and plant mature planting that will actually carry the same effect that of the existing corridors and in addition they'll be they'll be many more burst B shares and others T and and trees that than actually there at the moment evidence by the by the increase in the biodiversity and just with regard to the to the overheating and the potential for trees to to protect overheating and create warmth the where where the corridor is the the blocks that are adjacent to that corridors probably don't benefit from any greater shading from the trees because of the kind of fed design of of the block where they have external walkways with the kind of cantilevered and decks above them which which provides the majority of the shading and has been evidenced by are by our reports
yes sorry I can't give you more information on the pollution and the ecology OK thank thank you thank you for the attention I think we we got the information we've got I think that's what we have to base our decision on
carried Kevin are you had a 1 foyers put pressure for the applicants leagues failed chair and yeah thank you Chair OS is actually voted before and Blackheath hair elegant the tourists and for coming subsidence we had a big collapse met the many years ago with the chalk at the with all the talk mining it you still on their and my concern is you that is about subsidence construction piling basement impact can I ever assurance that you know that these have been looked into checked what protections are we going to have against impact of of all that extra pressure on the ground in the area
absolutely so we we carried out a Phase II site destinations study which as part the application which gave us a bit enough detail Nugee prior to the construction phase or of the ground condition so we have all the evidence we we need in order set designer a suitable groundworks design and and as such as part of that will be a or b some no ground stability work so that there will be no issues and that would be in a part of our of our design package be signed off by by qualified engineers
OK thank you very much Mr. Spencer have my capital Wallaby your you'll you'll know the law after the those are obviously Building control structural engineering issues but sir thank you for assurance right Miss S Spencer thank you very much you could sit down now you are very welcome to stay in the online meeting if you want live in turn your camera off and we shouldn't need so
come back to you again
our Standing orders of course say that meeting should be included normally within two and a half hours of their advertise start time he did start slightly late due to technical difficulties but that means the until the circumstances you'd have to conclude by 10 o'clock unkeen as we've invested so much time and and people from outside the Council had certain in this that we should try and reach a decision in this process tonight so I'm going to ask Members the Committee first of all before we proceed if you'll agree to suspend standing orders until we reached decision on this item on the agenda and again I will
I hope so I am just trying to get something in the Charlesworth are looking at a minute Michael so is is that agreed by Members anybody dissenting make a noise or we go hand about something right I'll take that as agreed unanimously by members of the Committee then that we've suspending Standing orders
and then there will be an opportunity obviously after the person subject says to ask planning officers any other technical questions we want before we move to debate too low sum of seem to have started doing that already
I am acutely aware moving on the we have invited the objectors who are concerned about the potential for this development and risks of it into our meeting more than two hours ago now I hope their patience some there and perseverance it as long as houses that Mr. Hadley are you are you here please don't do come in I just going to check before you start as well Melanie S B are you are you in the meeting still I'm still in the meeting Chair
well done and Mr. Shields' I can see you go here to excellent right I lorry sorry that here and it is OK I very sorry you had twice on please please meet yourselves the moment until I like to speak good evening I'm very sorry it had to wait so long and I hope you appreciate that we are trying to TRO very thoroughly what this development plan will mean before going anywhere near letting happen and the next stage in the processes that we hear from you you you have 10 minutes between you on told that Mr. Hadley's going to present for five minutes and then
Ms S Bradley and Mr. Shields' are going to take two and a half minute it said she had sat your underselling yes as one strand OK so let Mr. Hadley duty will be to tell you when you when you got 30 seconds of your five minutes left or was yes Mr. Chairman OK and if you could well I'm going to do is ask your EeePad smoothly segue between the three presentations you're going to me I've had then all stay on line your microphone so and I'm sure members will have some questions they want the Fire are you you're welcome to ignore the bits that her rhetorical are not actually questions obviously we do want to be able to seek clarification of anything you tell us to make sure we understand fully before we move on to try and make a decision OK Mr. Hadley distantly young find my stopwatch again
and have changed to five minutes and 0 will tell you when you've got 30 seconds left and I'll do the same with the other two so I'll tell you when you had two minutes and you got 30 seconds left for each of you a cake and it says on my note that Melanie you're going second and Howard you're going spurred so Mr. Hadley if you could start practice start by outlying it'll who your representing because they need happen from a planning simply passing the closures and some I as Pete Hadley on a chartered Town Planning song representing the placards residents Group of which there are 112 objectors
it is acknowledged that the Council has to meet housing targets and regeneration should be encouraged however this should not be all costs in this case the development would have a severe overbearing and oppressive impact on surrounding residents given the quantum of development is proposed the constraint narrow nature of the site and its proximity to a substantial number of residential properties the harm that is identified heavily outweighs the benefits on to talk to you to know that this impact and our concerns regarding the content of the report before you evidence of the harm is provided by the applicant in a Daylight Sunlight report Appendix C of this shows the results in terms of the substantial loss of light that because to surrounding properties particularly numerous flats on many flaws within Chalk Hill House and Cardinal House referred to by the applicant this block D
existing Ground floor apartments in block the opposition much lower land and the application site and serve those with impaired mobility these residents would see a hundred percent their light loss taxable rooms these homes also have their private amenity space basing directly towards by the new four-storey BizSpark is proposed at its closest point the business stock would be only 3 point 8 metres away from these flats and would be a notch higher land the Ofsted report acknowledges this in paragraph 2 9 56 the report then goes on suggested Fergus Tinder 64 with a commercial block between 11 point 5 and 14 point 5 metres away from Carthouse and chalk allowance suspecting correct misleading
the officers' report tries to justify the loss of light of existing homes by stating that many poorly lit at the moment anyway however what like they do get is essential to their occupants and is not an excuse for their remaining light to be lost is isn't how planning works policy is there to protect light and amenity the Africans Daylight and Sunlight report attempts to justify the harm stating that maintaining light levels to existing residents has an overbearing impact on the development potential of the site once again this isn't how planning works the opposite here is true that available but other hugely overbearing impact or meant many residents that effectively officers not talking about the flats in Carlton House to talk the talk being dual aspect but decide all the lights can be lost two to one aspect but he's got another one so that's OK it's a bit like saying debate about the lighter Bakeer house you always got the front it doesn't really make sense the matter of overbearing impact isn't attributed any white by the case officer for example no reference at all is made to the overbearing impact the flank wall of the 4 storey commercial building would have on the rear of the two-storey semi-detached homes a number 78 78 blacking Hill furthermore the report enclosed subsisted this substantial 18 metre high commercial building OK a much higher land to existing apartments and only 3 point 8 metres away from many of them is not going to be an unacceptably overbearing it will clearly be hugely overbearing paragraph 4 the report acknowledges the count the Irish probably residential aside from the NHS plucky brain injury rehabilitation centre however the hospital comprises a residential use with patients living there
the front of the four storey commercial building would look directly towards hospital bedroom windows and a patient's caught your garden this will be harmful to their privacy and recuperation at 100 97 dwellings per hectare the residential density detail of the report is judged to be over policy Gardens which allows up to 170 pounds per hectare for the site having a Pete our rating of between 2 and 3 however officers basis calculation on the whole site area the residential development proposed only half of the site the residential density would be more like 393 dwellings factor in this represents a huge over development which helps to explain some of the issues have been highlighted which includes the removal of existing mature trees that have been mentioned tonight
in terms of parking to be car-free decide Minister Peter writing a four or more to comply with the in Policy 29 the report confirms the size of Peter writing of between two and three it cannot be therefore car-free the huge monitors a parking servicing sort of create is a one narrow shared access will Heute impact on backing fill the residential use the back of the site will also be incompatible the promotion use the front
the report quotes the applicant's Harvard report by stating that the vote would see their portraits reduced that the existing use and the access would be safer however how can this be the case given the quantum of development is proposed given the significant concerns or implore you to go against the officers' recommendation and to refuse permission on grounds of overdevelopment harm to residential amenity and insufficient parking thank you Chair they be very Barack over just about her I am bathetically left very well done right OK can we move to the other I think Millie you're going to go next ideas
that's right but he thank you at my name's Melanie Asby but these are the words of my neighbour whose asked me to speak on her behalf tonight she's unwell I'm speaking as a tenant living in the social housing areas of Parkside which are landlord Peabody as designated as reserved for families with complex medical conditions additionally the ground floor is assigned to tenants using wheelchairs some confined to a wheelchair and that is the area which will experience the greatest loss my own experience is typical of that of my neighbours and while I cannot pretend to speak for the individual circumstances of each one these general points are sufficiently strong to warrant your concern
the proposed commercial building would be sought all that a significant proportion of his would be completely cut off from the very little natural light that we are getting now are bedrooms and kitchens would become unbearably dark even in day time we currently enjoy the benefit of a line of mature trees facing our patios and walkways which provide seasonal interest and dappled light in addition to filtering the air all of which supports our physical and mental health this is significant as many residents suffer from respiratory illnesses including my two small children proposal to replace the trees elsewhere on the site would offer no benefit to us and I refer you Councillors to the footnotes in the written version of this application
the major construction works proposed would have a second significant adverse impact upon our health with a generation of a large amount of particle pollutants the new building would be less than 4 metres from our walkways and patios and would cause a loss of privacy and a very overwhelming and depressing feeling of being squashed a planned pedestrian access route to the rear of the business block would further add to our loss of privacy and safety the amount of increased activity generated by the position and size of the proposed block will bring a freeze traffic thank you my concern is that many residents are key workers working night shifts across a number of services for example the hospital social services and cleaning companies whose daytime sleeping patterns would be adversely affected but those of you who haven't made a site visit to assist your understanding of the issues I raise I append a selection of photographs on the following pages in the written submission these images clearly demonstrate the existing tree canopy and light levels and indicate what would be lost by the imposition of a solid wall far closer to as down the trees clubs that are
thank you very much OK good Caetani right OK and Howard are you or yawn can you colour muscly of triggering a attorney mercy I'm Howard Shiels and I'm representing the Blackheath Society we have no objection in principle to development on this site of this application has positive features new homes affordable housing emphasis on sustainability but as it stands it entirely inappropriate for this site with its particular topography configuration and neighbours I hope committee members of managed to visit the site I in my long experience of never seen in application where this is more relevant we regret to say that the officer's report does not do justice to the scale or represent an address adequately the detail of the objections put forward by residence where
and repeat to the issues raised which the Committee should discuss in detail firstly this application tries to do far too much for the small and complicated site you heard about the effective residential density which is far above guidelines this due to the inclusion of the large commercial block on the otherwise residential site you silly the resulting very problematic and complicated access possibly unsafe place face two thirds of which is on the roof while proper play space public play spaces a long way away and the loss of the 38 trees already highlighted by Councillors and the Tree Officer this is an amenity issues are well as an ecological issue and is not earn redressed by a green wall secondly the officer's report rarely fails to do justice to a serious issue here of a development includes this four storey commercial block
which according to applicants own submission will cause severe harm to neighbours especially the disadvantaged social housing neighbours in Parkside there is no detailed attempt in the officer's report to acknowledge and analyse these harms also weigh them up critically as it should against the supposed incremental employment benefits
not to mention the major construction impacts on neighbours look ever to the crew on this particular site so we believe it's incomprehensible and to conclude as the report does in paragraph 3 3 0 9 that there are no significant adverse effects on neighbours we then for us the committee to probe these issues most carefully and reject the application as it stands furniture
how thank you very much with Shell thank you thank you all of you please stay on the line but Sir leave your microphone muted are going to ask members of the Committee first of all I am if they got any questions your I'm going to ask the mistaken direct them particularly to or whichever of you they think it appropriate and because other 3 they should be based on what
he just told us just before that I'm just going to check with the officers technically facilitating the meeting I seen the lurk come up saying 5 minutes left in the meeting and I do hope you'll be able to reassure a soulful that's the of the people managing the IT infrastructure bank think yet again that they can override the decision that elected members of just taken so suspend Standing orders and extend the meeting so that we can make a meaningful conclusions of this process so so big nor Jasmine can you reassure either that he is not going to automatically Shattuck self often for another 3 minutes or something
Tina is there
it's the time spent flooded centimeters fall but it will not shut down I do not think it's Ristol down but once I didn't confirmed that by so I got why why NIEA gets had hadn't had Councillor derived suggest relied invader she would like to speak under Standing orders I do think it's important we hear from summary as in the role of a ward councillor of course for aware that Councillor Bollettieri's of Ward Councillor for blacking as well but he is here as I as a member of the Planning Committee who will be voting on the application and not as a ward Nelson his own as sci-fi's their boys not answering right were could you I am not going to and knocking ask you to participate in any other way because at least the next five minutes Jazmine so if you could make sure that the meeting doesn't shut itself down because we will really be very very very cross with the drafter of piety if that does happen OK let's move on so Members whose gothic I I've got her question indicated for the objectors from I think Councillor Karon first
think Councillor Bonavena so let's typos Nicky indicate who you want to answer and key to base your question as far as possible in listing more detail on whatever he objects of said to us rather than anything else at this stage please say fleeing go ahead thank huger my Christian is full Mr. Hadley
the question is could you perform benefits her explain exactly again which blocks which dwellings are going to be suffering from loss of light and if you wanted to expand on the detail of that thank you thank you Councillor Khan much appreciated that the most significant impact would be on what's called block the
and if you look to where he could see page 7 of the Daylight and Sunlight report avoidably African that's of that residents in Cardinal house and Chalkhill house out the impact on those those properties is detailed within Appendix C of the date on reporting that's not the whole regime of red figures that show the impact can be caused a loss of light
one thing to be to be aware of their council corridors that this died on solid report was commissioned in June when all the trees would be in full leaf and they have amenity value all year round obviously the more light is afforded to the put to the to the facts when the leaves are off the trees in in autumn winter and therefore will get more date on summer would be afforded to the practices of results so that that looks to give their report fatal results but the Ring of negative figures within this report as the county's hugely significant no greater so than the the lower ground floor apartments when those blocks that have their amenity space outside took facing towards the sites towards the commercial block and their loss will be obliterated by this development I that is a habitable elevation our habit or windows with now nurse at the closest point 3 point 6 metres away so that's a significant concern of say that the remit that the attempt to address this by proposing a green ball but a growing was not in my opinion a solution to bad planning it's a it's an 18 metre high 4 storey building with an extreme proximity to these parties the report this replacing a landscaped amenity screen at the moment living compatible thank you
right councillor Olivier length the pink and thank you Chair as one for Mr. Hadley as you know where you've you've got expertise his planning consultant you know a lot of it it's it's taking account and placing weight on certain issues and and you you know you've made a case for saying Well look the overbearing so much the you know the solar is so much you it's it's for us and something for me I mean I have to weigh these things very carefully on and to be able to sort of say something is really overbearing in incurred in comparison to what in terms of the in terms of the average you know what we go over the guile of I just want to understand to what extent this really is in in your opinion really overbearing really you know that the actual going beyond what what what what you think is acceptable
thanks pounds Councillor behaviour in planning looking at residential amenity there are really three key things to look at there's whether something is going to result in loss of daylight and sunlight as whether something is going to result in an overbearing impact residential properties and as the issue of overlooking if you're dealing with reducing those impacts you know normally site new development away from existing development where that development are proposing is of significant scale for instance if you're in a suburban area you would propose a new home to be 15 metres away from another where where innovations don't look towards each other where the motion stood at towards each other more even more generous distance in that we appreciate in its on urban settings those standards are to be relaxed somewhat however
to have a four storey business unit block on land is probably about 5 metres higher than the lower ground floor flatted in those apartments within at its closest point like three and a half metres away from them that employment
would be overbearing in itself and harmful and would result result in a loss of Lloyd's when you combine that with the other amenity impacts of this a front elevation of a 4 storey commercial block looking towards what is a residential hospital where those occupants in a hospital should yet be afforded son quite relief for their recovery is a residential use of the North but it's not a Dr surgery it's a residential environment now you look at the overbearing impact you see the small garden serving on the 78 78 Blackley Hill when you look at the bottom their gods another flank wall of four storey block
at the bottom this is that we are there and they're not something needs about tonight without willing to come on too strong of been a Chartered planning and son for the last 18 years
and this is probably one of the worst impacts on residential amenity of seen on a development being proposed and that's not talking to obstruct the point of it is that significant I mean it's something that is a reasonably emotive issue for a lot of people locally
and it's even emotive for independent planning consultants being assigned to look at it that's touts from your feel about it
thank you very much with plenty of it would make that very clear OK I got a one more question from it for you indicated from Councillor Walsh James come in bleeds Jack I will be asking a follow up to the officers when we go back into the ping-pong mode have tonight's debate but Mr. Hadley you set out clearly 3 three reasons why you believe this should be turned down as an application could I ask you to restate them please to win an Oscar officers to tell us why I think you those do not hold weight in the Gulf
yes your Council sets of question
I recommended that you refuse planning permission for this on the grounds that is an overdevelopment of the site in order the quantum of development being proposed I'll talk due to the density and I'll talk to to how the density of residential development is be based on calculating the whole site area working out from that in fact residential and covers half the site and therefore almost double up the residential density there's already over thence he policy Policy tolerances there's real question OK here Ivor as well as other as well as over the Velleman there's obviously the mention of my there in terms of this having an impact a harmful impact on the residential amenities of surrounding properties through not of daylight and sunlight no overbearing impact and through an a Pret oppressive impact of that front elevation of the business building on the hospital itself which is a residential accommodation and a third point really sense that back to this disport I think the numbers discussed earlier is that I believe that your policy in terms of parking written states that you will go car-free where a site as a Peter writing of 4 and above
at the start of the officers confirmed as a Peter writing between 2 and 3 so not entirely sure how that provides justification for this development be car free
and not just exacerbates residents' concerns in terms of the impact on this and the surrounding road network how people actually come to from the site morphine honest that gets a lot of bases of three sub report says that over over the relevant harm to amenity insufficient insufficient parking for the development bear in mind is picked our writing we did look at Estadi think well what they don't know they develop this site it is allocated business you site so we need to keep some businesses on there was a policy objection to try to cram that in front then we try to get the residential back to have our cake and eat it doesn't really work for
and I hope that explains not boy that's resulted in all these concerns being of demonstrable harm that outweighs any benefit this despot there the benefits that that are shown within the but in a design of the buildings themselves thanks OK thank you very much I think you make that quite clear I checked with the way officers are approached Michael specifically whether you have a specific note or which or labels be this impact on residential amenity that Mr. Hadley has just out line apace we get to that point
cause I I'd rather stick to procedure or not bring objectors or Africans' backing once we move beyond that stage of the meeting her have you got that a clear noted that Michael yes I've got no of all of 03 if you owe him in terms of Vale that were neighbours and the property Patti were happy information
with regard to be overdevelopment query I mean the measure density across the site so we don't consider the measure to be incorrect
and then he is on paragraph 86 28
so we consider that in this urban about location is deserting acceptable but the against the if we get to that point will whilst will seek advice from you but not from the applicant or objectors own what what they what what your advice to assess on the accurate figures if this dispute about the figures and take had I'm just what it to make sure you got a note of those potential reasons that is sadly an outline so I don't have to call him back again
OK that's great thank you very much hand I think that was all the questions I can see indicated for Members for objectors so before thank you very much for your seen all three of you and eating Kenny Antonio cameras off now because you're not
no longer actively participating in the meeting that we are most grateful and most grateful for your persistence in and sticking it out and we haven't finished yet because there are really three more stages we need to go through and you've some you'll give me carte blanche to suspend Standing orders until we finished doing that so as one go first of all we are going to hear from Councillor deride under Standing orders she is my predecessor in this role and set it back
I hope she appreciates the and doing it right and she's speaking as ward councillor Amanda as you know because you've sat he where I'm sitting 1 or my sofa but you know what any
then there is no time limit on you and the opprobrium of your fellow Councillors cosy will be keeping a start even later so I think you know the drill but do please inform us in your role as one of the Ward Councillors representing Blackheath and element Ross you some questions about it but we might not go ahead the flow shows
thank you John and
even recognise that this is the first time in fact that I have appeared in front of your Committee to make such a representation said I hope not to try your patience on all fellow Members but but also I think that does that does indicate the level of concern about this application in in black even amongst residents
I think the first thing I would say is that I I did a a site visit with residents and my fellow Councillors a few months ago and I would say that that the differential in height between the applicant site and between the blocks on Parkside really has to be felt to be properly understood I notice I noted the officers diagram with the kind of you know trees in the building and the lines and everything but that doesn't begin to express actually what it feels like when you're there and I think and ditto the trees are you know trees serve many purposes here and I know that I'm you know now that there's been a long discussion about category C trees what I think you you have in this in the space where the trees are is a kind of green screen and a green corridor as described by members and officers
but for the residents of Parkside that screen is really critical and and I would say that a green wall is not enough mitigation fought for those residents on the impact of the of what it will essentially be a blank four storey wall right outside their windows and as the consultant made the planning consultant make clear you know 3 point 8 metres mean that nothing you know that's a few steps and it really feels like that when you are actually there and I think the case has been made well that these residents you know the these aren't kind of after a residence he can afford to kind of in a move elsewhere deep these are some of it some of the borough's most in them residents with the most needs and this is there in it this is these other homes and and I think this really that the impact of this development really will be significant on them I mean I don't want way to state the case but I really think it will be and I know at and I hope that I hope that Members if Members were minded to approve that I hope that they would consider going and seeing the site before the before they actually made that decision at the point was made by by members that young trees have a high failure rate residents of Parkside know that well because in spite being severely and heavily conditioned by our planners at there's been a massively high failure rate of of any landscaping on Parkside and that's partly because it was installed by builders rather than gardeners and and it was just shoved it with with very little care and and has had to be consistently constantly replaced I mean it's been really poor actually and and so I think that
I know that I architects and developers want to you now want to balance out the kind of that the benefits of of new landscaping but actually for people who live there it that you know it really doesn't have the same valuable or impact I I thought the the planning consultant made a very good case I would agree that it is definitely overdevelopment of the site and it is definitely overbearing and the daylight sunlight issue is not negligible for those residents and I also agree with the with the comments made around the Peter rating and the car free nature of the of the application site we already have these problems on Parkside which is also intended to be a low car of no car development and and you know if you try and if you try and what Randy you see cars parked skewed willy nilly in their fad to put in parking schemes and wardens and and and enforces in its attend into an absolute nightmare and I think it's it's a beautiful dream but at the moment I just don't don't think it's really viable and the transport is actually quite a long way away and difficult from from that site so I would just I will conclude there thank you for your patience I would say that if Members are minded to approve this they really should see at first I really think that that you have we have a duty to do that
thank you very much Amanda and and I heard about that cafeteria Campbell is in the meeting as well but it's very sensible that you represent yourself through in one of you speaking to us I'm not seeing any indications that Members want to ask any questions on that because I think you bake yourself very clear
so obviously a welcome Stybar take if we can now go to the next stage explore the issues we park we'd offices and there were a couple specifically I know that we'd an part full I promise that I would ask officers to come back to and Patsy Michael who is going to
they take that and Members could you remind me what they were please because I think my maiden as a lot of plus of ensuring meeting so far but not that
the Russian monarchy with Michael is that you are caught notes on the four-setter thresher worth over development than to say they live in any overbearing impact to neighbour to the rear and to the front
of the workplace building are had and the passage that daylighting are bearing an issue intensive as about either bitterlemons and density and the agenda set out in paragraph 86 88 now density and if anyone marker of skimmed of ability and not have to shift away to designing schemes firefighting I calculation per hectare and is a more design design lead process notwithstanding and we consider the density to be acceptable on this site in an urban location so officers in a has not raised an objection
there the paragraph 88 both in terms of the habitable room it would go over the calculation that by unit it will be compliant so it's compliant in one sense equal it's a different measurement it was it would be in excess but but either way officers are on non objectionable today's identity
OK
the other point the Hunter with the party
say a kiss-and-tell erased in terms of overbearing impact and stay as sunlight and tight privacy at sea Vijay started with overbearing impact of officers have considered this and we all whilst the distances between and Cardinal house and chalky House to the application site and the fact that the commercial building will be brought to to the boundary of the application site
I'm afraid there will be instances where the building will be relatively close between themselves but the side gets wider say I'm as we go along there is a so further distance it's important to note that an upper floor so first second and third floor we'll be a set away from the boundary so you will have even greater distance I'm cranky the was the that
the residents to see a belt of trees we have tried to mitigate that loss and asked the applicant to provide some climbers and green roof said that this mitigated and the impact is not that much of different of it will be different for dumping at it's a significant difference to refuse this Planning application on this grounds are with
reform in relation to the two properties of 79 70 78 78 a on a black or heave Hill yes they got Aswarby our facing towards a side elevation of the Fullbrook block house but we have considered that that's not against going to receive an acceptable such level to refuse planning application we have a number of urban design officers from GLA and Purcell's assessing and proposal end they've considered that's to impact the building will have on urban task he is is acceptable
I am moving onto the daylight as we as I said before my presentation during the discussions that we've had
the building on Chalkhouse and Cardinal House the way though this buildings have been designed they do have existing walk weeks which reduce the AGM the they lead available and at the or prevent any views of of the sky so I think that needs to be taken into consideration and then we can only start considering the impact the proposal have and the site of a report there has been submitted what the has demonstrated is that the impact of proposal Howell burnout negligible because of two existing situation and the M initial design of this boy so again officers how foot about this and we haven't decided that we surf took the existing and proposed and measurements making decisions I also should know that we are an urban context and it's not completely unacceptable for buildings to be in relative proximity and taking all the benefits and negative aspect of the proposal refilled with the mic mitigations that will be prepared that the impact will be acceptable and touching on privacy and impact the commercial building will have on the hospital site it's not unusual for and other buildings to be close to hospital sites and
the commercial building is it's going to be used for people working so they will be doing certain activities out
for this reason we didn't feel
that's the overlooking will be to such an extent that this application should be refused of would be unacceptable and touching on the
the points that have been raised about the coffee development of the sides I would like to know that first of all yes are policy is saying that application people of 4 will be acceptable but a London Plan is actually a Sir saying that Pakistan so far he suffered in the London Plan I am I the maximum standards and for those reasons we we do thing at this 0 2 qualifies to be car-free developments
relating to the comment about Peto theme between 2 and 5 their calculations are based on the proximity and frequency
of
of the development to their services and and I just want to point out that there is a bus of directly outside of the site so whilst the Peto mob my be relatively low
there is a good level of accessibility around the application site's I'm seer thing there are opportunities and and I think I trust I touch on those two points that have been raised an by the objectors OK
alpha wolf
gawker an additional question for you and so as Councillor clock and on the assumption you've not for him to those just now James go ahead with it
please
I'm sorry not
presuming which way committee might swing on this one and there are some things that I want to ask officers about additional conditions if we were minded to by not sure I'm not sure how this can land so conditions I think this relates to conditions 12 and 13 I think quite a lot of stock is being put into these living walls living roofs activity I want to make sure they are specifically mentioned within condition 12 and also in conditions 13 that they're maintained in perpetuity because we did hear from Councillor Ryk that other nearby developments in the next door neighbours have had significant problems with the maintenance of of planting in the area and as is so central to the mitigation of the negative effects that befell by this development I think we'd to ensure that there is an very
implementation plans for the landscaping scheme that keeps it alive if it was to fail replanted I also want to make sure that we haven't lost in our conversations the conversations about access to the roof top amenity now I am still and do remain very concerned about this
our response to this because it has been that this Committee a number of times and I would like to see a form of words that words look at ensuring access to both Recep are both rooftops for any resident within the development it was to be agreed this evening
and the only reason I think that should not the allows if it fails then to Evatt relevant fails to achieve the appropriate design stack the safer by design standard
I think I would like to see some spool of conditional vary until condition that allow for them
what could we are having a lot trying to drop the precise words of that Burfict an unassuming if we got to that point we could ask officers to come back with a draft having made our intentions clear but could could we say that what we want to ensure is the all residents regardless of the tenure have access to all amenity spaces that are available to residents of
all of the residential units provided which would that express what their am hand that we we expect the applicants to propose the detail of
and access management scheme that will enable the what that doesn't that sound as it covers it James
after concerns from the Met's safer by design officer of give me as a different black bins have clearly yes Michael Forrester says he has made notes of that requirement should be come to that point but let let me just say and before I got a couple of other questions for officers on our new items
how are taken to proceed is nearly half past tends only been going for three hours some biscotti a bit early as well the I'm going to when when we've exhausted those questions I'm going to untestable Sasai asking anybody and will asking somebody to propose the
recommendations with amendments we made to condition and switch would result in some sort of approval I am going to ask us to take a vote on that and if effect forms than I'm going to ask for alternative proposals OK so that's how I intend to proceed within the time we got left now got other questions festival from Councillor Clarke and then Councillor current in Council of Olivier so Councillor Clarke you don't please thank you and it was just on the density I would just want officers to go back it then the in planning consultant mentioned the half residential have commercial and therefore the density should be really looked at from a different perspective and I wondered if you could come in on that and get some more clarity on that because that seems to be extremely important in the argument and they'll things just a quick comment and it is a neurological hospital with brain surgery neural can I have some expertise in the area worked for a neurological charity and specialist hospitals
and and
the it's mental health is very very important in that type of setting and particularly in the yen care after care of any any things such as neurological injury and Bryn surgery so I think can we have to take that into account on the impact on people from that because they were talking about the overlooking and the overbearing on hospital it's not just a hospital it's a neurological hospital and that's a completely different aspect so but if you could come back on the density please
thank you Patsy that you
he added
I say as I think Michael has covered the point and St and explained how we have calculated it is also important to look at the site said in London and what what we are encouraged to do as officers is to look at design late April led approach to side to determine psych Fassi and we think that the applicant has successfully demonstrated that 5 uses can coexist
on the site without an causing any issues which this has led us to believe that proposed density is appropriate for this site location give in abolish nation 2 that's the reasons why we reach a decision on the distance then 2 point of you on the issues that you phrased with with the hospital we are aware was the purpose of the hospital and what's of patience and are being cared for their however looking at the whole development as a whole we did not believe that this development will impact on them so significantly that this application should be refused and that's what we prepared a recommendation as we did and I think I also touched up on on some of the issues and in terms of the impact the proposal half of them are if you want me to revisit and make of it and I'm happy to do that but so I just want to reassure you that we have considered those points
what could we recommend that I'm a Liam Councillor Khan
you have a question for the officers thank you Chair errm
I find it very difficult to do that in in the report as says as our eyes
item 7 is below which is the majority of the report is all about planning considerations for this is the bit that were supposed to look at the come soon become so and get the balance right and beyond it and I can't find any reference whatsoever to the tree officer's report in that second
say what social their employees' referred to the Section 7 planning considerations page 26 that goes on for obviously the most of the document I can't find any reference to the tree officer's report whatsoever in that sad yet those sectors are included in urban design comments said there are on page
but he go on page 47 of the report paragraph is that it's progressive and plea 5 so suffered a 75 and from paragraph to hundreds to 207 and the impact of the proposal on
On the public realm trees and landscaping is considered and discussed you that's that's no reference to the tree officer's report which has 12 different planning policies which backs up the
damage to the environment of course has no reference to the tree officer's report
the tree officers comments are summarised in first but the reports
finally the
internal consultation so that paragraph 43 so heelless their comments
that is to say that they're not that those and they're not summarised the her concerns and all the planning policy she mentioned are not summarised at all I should just as its deck detrimental to landscape or me to in character that's not what you saying in her report to say a whole lot more besides that is not the section which we are supposed to discuss planning considerations so the tree officer's report Chair has been omitted completely from are considerations I disagree of this statement her comments happy summarised and in the body of the report we have taken a view we have consulted and vast especially
that Cabinet's LAM
the Planning Considerations bit might be the between voting to see what that the factors are on which were fit to be Fishkin they will be expected to read the whole of the report and the have access to all of the more detailed documents including the tree officer's report which which I know we have now had access to and we had an informal discussion about that yesterday
their houses
so I chatted I think it's it's not in the planning considerations so I think it's of major weakness Newark
well OK but I I think we're here to decide on on the application not on any of technicalities of the quality of the report as presented we can discuss that somewhere else but I don't get frozen for us to do that now or to try and get into that sort of argument with officers that's that we've or local yet which made about what's mentioned but I think you brought it to our attention
bright I'm gonna go on Councillor B Olivier you got a question on EU matters for planting offices or for the legal Officer yeah serve planning of service would clarify this conflict of fact about how close the the new build is to the parks I buildings is it is the closest at is actually three and a half metres or as actually widen that
the crisis point is Freeplay 9th ground stole the widest point is 7 point 2 of the ground floor it then goes up to 7 point free overt say on 1st 2nd 3rd and 2 11 point 6 at the widest point so date days at the measurements
or it but must record question answer Councillor shake has reminded me yes one of the issues that we parked for further comment by officers was about whether we could in the context of this application rather than the more generally explore
further the possibility of pepper potting the affordable housing in this development and I hope I'm I'm wondering I supposed to trying to translate the industry to something answerable if officers could tell us if we were minded to grant permission to this application whether they could suggest an appropriate condition or at least informative which would make that clear to the applicant or the applicant has indicated their willingness to do if they can find an hour fee partner to do it with can forget that what the Michael conference
so having a think about it I mean it would be in my view better as an obligation rather than a banner than a condition
and what we could do with applicant has already said they're they're willing to continue discussion is we could have an obligation which requires them to promote the pepper-pot simply for housing units following further discussion with our pays which they would need to show to the Council for approval in a formal reports and we could define how they do that
so they couldn't for example just to benefit the paper said we tried we can do it they would have to go to a certain amount of detail which we could switch we could secure formerly OK that that was that was unbelievable
I mean I mean that sounds as as much as we can get out of them we it has to have some of the best efforts clause in it given that it's not of required policy yet meanwhile become one but it isn't now could we could we also add in the same way into the section 1 0 6 agreement that would apply here the the issue that I outlined about equality of access to to amenity space for regardless of tenure as it seems that putting back in 2 because we we'd need to ask them to come up with a a properly explored method statement for how they were going to do it or demonstrate that they had exhausted possibility could we do that in the same place
and forget that some further thought in my initial thinking was that day the put the accesses top the she would be better by planning condition
OK right right OK
so I I gave a couple of questions the cleaner go ahead I guess the man standing for ban was added they have done or not and they're happy to continue but what they need is some muscle how from the county of be almost a to from level of negotiation with our peace so I think that's a great suggestion from Michael but I think it needs to feel safe then it's been moved to in terms of what would a council do to assist his negotiations and because it sounds like almost informally at that can is up for that obligation although I think it helps to put it in writing as well but what was required was since support I feel I think we're I think we're we're free to say that and clearly what we leastways as far as the Council are minded to say that we could only put requirement sooner or sexual I 6 agreement attached to a planning permission on on the applicant we can't composer those requirements and ourselves as the Council or on some random third party who is a registered provider of affordable housing so I think we can there is no bar to as making that statement but the thing we could we could bind into the planning permission is is what Michael's described the that binds the applicant OK
May and the recipe for a discussion with our cabinet lead
apart a separate suppliers customers and I hadn't pardoned by of so you show I'm sure we'll absolutely show Council of Elwood P the B 2 before that we we heard him on it many a time so
that that wouldn't they wouldn't be allowed
Councillor Battle
right I have guessed and and what we can do Deloitte see where we get to tonight and hopefully for limitless right I see no more questions needing further information from officers I haven't had an indications 0sorry Council shall beg your pardon I missed you out tonight
Derby sorry I that there are too many narratively things pouring into the chap that's what's going wrong
for classic night and overseas question so I'm
whilst I think procedural motion has been moved which I think might cause up me now but I'm wondering and reading that reading the rim whether or not we should be getting some some legal advice as to the strength of some of the discussions in the way in which we should be applying some of them
well I are you suggesting that them you think we should go into closed session to get that sort of legal advice
I suspect you are
it would be useful obviously that's up to you Chair or members as a whole OK I'm not quite like I think in this case
in my judgment is that we've been given some
An outline of what would be sustainable reasons for refusal as well and I'd like to proceed the why I suggested and in view of how Longley taken so I would like to find I think Councillor Given's has offered
while I have another site motions procedural other otherwise in the chat because I said at the beginning of the meeting that I would use the chap for that purpose only for practical management the meeting
so I'm going to try and proceed the way I asked line and I'm going to ask Councillor Given's you have suggested that you would like to move a motion to seek a resolutions there
yes or no but that that that was that was in the chaplain and and we've already rolled out using the chat to triumph had consent to the meeting merely to progress he administration of the meeting so I'm not going to conduct the meeting through the chest it was just one of my skinny ozone temujin well all right yes I was just if I can have going for us what you might be minded to move Councillor given year I'm I'm I wasn't sure how to you or anyone said I should have been a full sentence I've for ACU it was a main question I know I know what the question very very honest of you but carry on such as like another of that is around what it was he was going to lose yes I just want since to movement emotions 2 supports the officer's recommendation
and to grant planning approval to this application I can get some justification as wide concept decision if he's happy clapping the officer's recommendation has has given reasons for approval justification for if you like so what I what I'm trying what I'd like to be able to do please if you if you'll allow me is to proceed in that way so I would like to table a motion based on the recommendations in front of us made by officers first of all I don't think we're going to gain for from additional advice legal or otherwise and in-camera or in public so I'm not going to at this time of night try and seek that cause I don't think it won't get us anywhere different so I I just south so what I'm intending to do is to allow you to move that Percival and we will test we will test that with a vote because testable either decisions and if that falls then we will test a proposal to do something else with this application which I suspect will be moved by Councillor Cullum is that is it OK Liam you that's a tone
yes
just with the proviso that I do accept you when you imagine meeting but I mean if that's the case then we as Councillor Walsh once clarification legal advice and I think we're going to make a decision based on insufficient evidence so that's why would refuse
the proposal was the first bar but yes I will happily I proposal afterwards yes
felt last can you be more specific on what what areas you think we need advice on potentially in in camera before we can proceed in the way that I doubt lie because I I think I think if if we if we were minded to reach a refusal on this application I think we've got what seemed to me to be at least defendable reasons for refusal
and can I don't think I don't think we're gonna get any more clarity on those from the bison officers at this stage and Michael do chip in if you think we are going to get more clarity but don't go into any detail that he rather conveyed to us in private but James can you be more specific on on what you think we need advice on that we haven't got I was aiming to seek advice on strength of reasons for refusal as outlined okay okay bright noted Right okay well that's let let
chaplains of on a canal and place there's also decision you can define and one of the Ward Members suggested that she defer for a site visit just to draw your attention to that by our I'm well aware of the her hearing that from all the ward Members
again I am in difficulties of Enoch reaching a decision it's it's going round the surround belief again and actually I feel that we got enough advice to record enough information to reach a decision
several of us all very familiar with the site already even if we haven't busy in the context of this application so I had an and we have got a wealth of information in front of us and obviously some of that information supports proving a lot of that information supports not approving it and thus her I feel we got enough to do that OK James are going to accede to your request and or suspend the web cast and go into a shop close session that does mean we will lead to successfully manage removing the people who are not members or officers or our legal adviser from the meeting and that didn't happen very seen the state of the beginning of the meeting so I will need you to make sure it does happen at this point
and would like some brief advice from Planning and legal officer on the strength of the reasons have been outlined I know Michael has out line though that of has made a note of those and understands what those are OK is that agreed members
please it's OK inside quickly sex ed you'll meeting and invite members of any joint this one again because I didn't said the smitten I didn't send this advice Claudette is not here inside so many because other members of the public can enter in without a stopping them
right OK I got I thought it might be difficult games with ego
and their dignity
will tell me how we're going to do this then shall we shall we decide to suspend the public meeting where we more-or-less about doing that here now destined rooms Wakefield if you could I have you are still with us and conscious if he
suspend the web not not your James Walsh the other journeys

3 Blackheath Business Estate, Blackheath Hill, London, SE10 8BA

he's changes and it seems to be seen
OK thank you and to those of you still watching the public webcast of our resumed strategic planning committee meeting I'm sorry for the delay while we took and then discussed legal advice on the scope for our decision
I don't think there are any other questions we need to ask officers
I'm sorry I am just checking the the check concert make sure everybody still connected
Councillor L shape I believe you you said during outflow session that you had a very brief period of disconnection from the meeting
and we took advice from our legal adviser he said he thought that when the made a material difference to your perceptual lump the standing of the City of facts of the application but Charlie if you like to just confirm that that's what we discussed in closed session face-to snow got a perfect accurate representation of their discussion so thank you for that I thank you thank you very much so I don't think that that disqualifies you from participating in
have out I'm going to admit Hilary again to the meeting
right Councillor Given's I would like to invite you to make a proposal first of all please so that we can get on with reaching some decisions Hillary could you could you turn your mike and camera off please chess murder thank you very much
has she gets the there with my backing proposed that we vote in favour of the Officer's recommendation it's gone approval to the application before us
I guess it is time for my soliloquy at half past 11
I I'm I'm reminded of a and the London School of Economics study that determined that in large global cities with and I quote a modest blend approach density housing and transport policies could cut their emissions by a third by 20 30
I do understand that we are removing some 46 trees in this site however we are replenished Nate with her biodiverse landscape her we also providing high density housing and business base that upper knees we have ambitious housing targets to give the people of this borough what they need I do feel for the residents of Cardinal house and talk or how some who will be impacted by this development but as the officer put very well earlier this is a urban setting buildings are often close together I feel the benefit the scheme for outweighs the negative and that's why I'm supporting of this recommendation
I am hoping that spending that has moved that the figure that has been a planning committee lotion right Councillor again very were I sat on the get seconding that OK we will take a roll call vote on that please and as this is the first folk might be last overexposed overly taking I'll just ask members with the exception that had been already discussed with Councillor shakes brief disconnection and if you can confirm the you have been able to participate in the proceedings throughout all of the evidence we've considered and then expressed your vote either for or against or abstaining from the recommend from the proposal that has been made by Councillor Gibbons so Jazmine if you could conduct a roll call vote on that basis please
that's me done 10 10 thousand class or you're going to do it OK Clare's father OK since the Paschal I'm voting for the proposal and I have been fully connected to the proceedings throughout thank you Councillor Gibbons
yes I'm looking for and I happened to connected fat cats urban then thank you you'll be fully connected throughout the proceedings I'm voting against
thank you Councillor Clarke I've been fully connected and I'm voting against
thank you Councillor Cohen
OK sorry Councillor Khan yours and make them
I've been fully plugged in to the proceedings and I'm voting days
thank you
Councillor open that day
amid fully connected drought proceeded I'm voting for
Councillor shake
I will briefly disconnected for under two minutes and but other than that I was covered and I'll be voting against
Councillor Walsh
those are connected for the duration of the meeting and I will be voting
0
full
thank you for that and for the recommendation for and against for so the Chair has the consummate
OK that's interesting isn't it well I I've had Hambly consistent in their circle not going about one by than they would otherwise so I will of course be cast dating mark with my casting vote
in the same way that I voted initially for the recommendation for for the proposal some disabled
it's
but thank you thank you come right at the in my lap against that's all right but were therefore right in that case the proposal and has moved by Councillor Givens is a case
agreed by the Committee it's actually just clarify it's it's it set out on stage I'll remember what that the Planning Officer will remind us if necessary of the written report but it is to substantially recommendations to an agreed as Ocean council and refer the application and this report and any other documentation to the Mayor of London
because it is something that the Mayor of London also has to a great R and subject to no different direction being received from the Mayor of London's home proceed with the making or section 1 0 6 agreements are subject to the amendments that we have discussed the enormous length with officers
and the be noted and had been included in the recording of this meeting so subject to all of those provisos planning permission her has amended has been granted I'm thank you very much thank you very much indeed to everybody on the applicants and the objector side who had participated in helping to inform Asprey difficult decision which has changed what's on the table at the beginning of the evening but the the outcome his thoughts are former faces planning permission has been granted and thank you all very much thank-you officers for all your support and during what the Sir technically rather difficult meeting thank you Members for your support and persistence this this far and with a goodnight everybody hand him season's greetings I don't happen to see any of you on the side of next year
thank you I'm James please